Every liberal does it too, from center right radlibs to far-right “conservatives”: the most extreme right fringe liberals hate the mainstream liberals for not being bigoted enough, the mainstream libs hate the radlibs for not being cruel enough, and the radlibs hate the left for not being chauvinist enough.
Denouncing chauvinism in particular is like a liberal moral event horizon, a cardinal sin against their self-interested belief in the righteousness of the imperial hegemon that keeps the treats flowing at gunpoint.
yeah… I was a liberal once, and it was definitely informed in large part by wanting to be “good” and correct. I became kind of a debatelord for a minute there. But, what I didn’t do, was shit my pants and demand the mods ban them when it became clear I was on the wrong side of something, I lived and learned and moved on (generally leftward). You gotta be able to take the L sometimes.
Liberals put a very high value on awareness of problems yet distrust people that want to do something about them.
As the official pod puts it, liberals live in a world full of victims but no victimizers
I wouldn’t put it like that, it’s more that they don’t see doing nothing as political, and consider being aware of the problem or even minor donations as a sufficiently positive action.
I just had flashbacks of Kony 2012
Liberals are incapable of understanding politics.
Period.
They’re used to only dealing with some form of Fox (or Fox Business) Conservative. Like, thats the only other form of politics they can fathom outside of some vague adherence to “smart government.” And when it comes to “getting stuff done” they think it’s just a numbers game: just get enough good Libs elected and things will be gooder, or some shit.
Like, forget war - which for some reason Libs can’t wrap their heads around that war is fucking bad. What’s the Lib response to climate change or failing healthcare or inexplicable income gaps? Vote harder? California is a Super Majority D state. Obama had Congress sewn up for 2 years. Conservativism is effectively dead where the majority of people live. So what’s the endgame? When does shit get better?
And that’s where Libs are left with an identity crisis because to admit any one little (but really fucking big) thing is beyond repair is admitting there are systemic problems that cannot be solved with the only tool in the shed: voting. And that’s basically the Lib version of staring into the abyss.
Everything a Lib knows is a fucking lie.
For liberals, war is a purely economic calculation whose criteria of justification are decided by whether or not they contravene principles whose evolved historical function is the preservation of capitalist social relations and the imperialist world system (whether the liberal in question is a mystified rube or a demonically englightened ghoul). Similarly, criteria of success or failure in war is based on economic calculation. Look at the U$ yankkkie defences of their proxy war in Ukraine: “no Americans are dying, it will weaken the Russian economy, we must secure our interests”. Of course we also know, as evidenced spectacularly by the U$ terrorist bombing of the Nord Stream pipelines, that the key objective is always the preservation of U$ economic hegemony, keeping a competitor economically disadvantaged, taking their economic customers in Europe and forcing them into economic dependence on America LNG.
It’s not always that what they know is a lie. Liberals often do know quite a bit, especially the more ghoulish ones. Most of them, yes, are rubes in a lot of respects. But the most basic normative axioms of their thought are detached from reality in a particularly striking way.
Of course when they fail by their own criteria (see: Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq, Yemen, Syria, Libya, etc…) they are never honest about this and use mental gymnastics to avoid responsibility, because that matters more, because the legitimacy of their views must be defended at all costs. This is inculcated into liberals as a matter of liberal cultural necessity because if it wasn’t, they would not be able to adequately defend those same capitalist and imperialist socio-economic systems they rely upon and in terms of which they determine their own self-worth.
Liberals are incapable of understanding politics.
Moralists don’t really have beliefs. Sometimes they stumble on one, like on a child’s toy left on the carpet. The toy must be put away immediately. And the child reprimanded.
for any lib lurkers, i recommend reading liberalism: a counter-history by domenico losurdo
In this definitive historical investigation, Italian author and philosopher Domenico Losurdo argues that from the outset liberalism, as a philosophical position and ideology, has been bound up with the most illiberal of policies: slavery, colonialism, genocide, racism and snobbery.
Narrating an intellectual history running from the eighteenth through to the twentieth centuries, Losurdo examines the thought of preeminent liberal writers such as Locke, Burke, Tocqueville, Constant, Bentham, and Sieyès, revealing the inner contradictions of an intellectual position that has exercised a formative influence on today’s politics. Among the dominant strains of liberalism, he discerns the counter-currents of more radical positions, lost in the constitution of the modern world order.
slavery, colonialism, genocide, racism and snobbery
What’s that song from Sesame Street?
I’m reminded of that Bo Burnham song, How The World Works
I’ve had parts of that song stuck in my head for like a year now, particularly the verse:
And private property’s inherently theft
And neoliberal fascists are destroying the left
And every politician, every cop on the street
Protects the interests of the pedophilic corporate eliteit’s very funny how he turned from Funny Internet Guy #4812 to a communist and probably the only actually good video essay I’ve ever listened to dealt with him and the views in that video are a core jigsaw piece in my personality and thinking
liberals despise anyone and everyone with better politics than themselves.
That blows up on Hexbear whenever someone gets mad at vegans for talking about the actual cost and harm done by the meat industry.
People were mad at the vegan comm because they were aggressive and confrontational dicks to everyone on the site while using the patina of veganism as an excuse.
Its why most of those very same vegans are all mostly banned off the website for their behaviors.
Its one thing to advocate for veganism, its another thing to for example call someone a “r*pe enjoyer” to a sexual assault victim for drinking milk in a thread completely unrelated to veganism.
Its one thing to advocate for veganism, its another thing to for example call someone a “r*pe enjoyer” to a sexual assault victim for drinking milk in a thread completely unrelated to veganism.
I may have missed the worst of that; I wouldn’t have said that myself.
I had not seen any recent examples of that, but the "vegan spoke up, how uncivil" thing percolates from time to time without anything near the insult you mentioned.
It was pretty much the only other experience with meeting other vegans on this site tbh, I was legit excited about more vegans being on the site…up until they started posting lol.
Some hilariously unhinged statements did come from them like:
Hunger isn’t a real thing. It doesn’t exist. If you make conscious decisions about what to eat based on an informed view of nutrition, you will still feel hungry. It’s not some magic signal telling you that you’re not getting enough nutrients, it’s a dumb feeling that exists in your head. You ignore it, and it goes away. The feeling of hunger cannot harm you.
and
Delusions may or may not go away if you ignore them, I have no idea, I’m not knowledgeable on that topic. What I can tell you for sure is that hunger does go away when you ignore it.
It was pretty much the only other experience with meeting other vegans on this site tbh, I was legit excited about more vegans being on the site…up until they started posting lol.
I’m kind of glad I either tuned it out or was just not in those subsections. I believe you when you say that happened and I remember some vegans talking about the mass bans and not liking those, but the context of what got them banned was lost.
Hunger isn’t a real thing. It doesn’t exist. If you make conscious decisions about what to eat based on an informed view of nutrition, you will still feel hungry. It’s not some magic signal telling you that you’re not getting enough nutrients, it’s a dumb feeling that exists in your head. You ignore it, and it goes away. The feeling of hunger cannot harm you.
Delusions may or may not go away if you ignore them, I have no idea, I’m not knowledgeable on that topic. What I can tell you for sure is that hunger does go away when you ignore it.
I appreciate the quoted bits of Hexbear history. Maybe some of the site’s cultural reactions toward vegans are more than lingering
cliches. Unfortunately.I actually saw that comment first hand and it was in the middle of a thread I was in and I got so fuckin mad. As someone who has been food insecure myself for most of my life and currently cannot afford a kitchen and will be hungry till I get to work and heat up my little bowl of 3 bean chili honestly seriously fuck that person that said that and I am glad they are gone.
Its one thing to advocate for veganism, its another thing to for example call someone a “r*pe enjoyer” to a sexual assault victim for drinking milk in a thread completely unrelated to veganism.
Hexbear, pondering how it is perceived on other instances:
None of the problems I’ve seen with vegans has been about the harm of the industry. We’re all aware of exploitation. The issue arises around some posters making it a very personal, individual attack on others rather that seeing that diet is also a place where capitalism has wielded its force. Calling someone that is on your side politically on many of the issues of the day a blood mouth doesn’t win allies
None of the problems I’ve seen with vegans has been about the harm of the industry.
I’m not so sure when all of the concern against caring too much gets brought up anyway.
Calling someone that is on your side politically on many of the issues of the day a blood mouth doesn’t win allies
Neither does smug “dae le vegans annoying scolds”
statements against vegans that generally aren’t even wrong about their takes at a material level.I’m just saying, you can be right about something but do it in a way where you alienate everyone.
If only they had more @[email protected] they’d stop getting raged at for daring to exist in a visible way on the internet.
Let’s set aside the people that were going to rage at you for daring to exist, because they’re not really who matter and you’re not going to change their minds.
I mean yeah, maybe the bit account @[email protected] does have some kernel of truth where being civil builds solidarity and wins people over and gets people to change instead of just screaming at them and then getting ignored.
looks at a clock. The numbers 1-12 are replaced with the words “STRUGGLE SESSION”
Good heavens, just look at the time
Even bringing up the tendency for struggle sessions summoned someone very concerned about uncivil veganism.
The problem with libs is that they beleve ideas make history. Once you put yourself in that mindset the chauvinism becomes more reasonable.
The west is the richest so they have the best ideas. Since the liberal idea set is self evidently the best the other countries are backward and their idea sets should be replaced.
In reality the reason the west has been richer for the last 3-4 hundred out of 10-14k years of agriculture has les to do with ideas or western culture and more to do with geografic and demografic realities, that are too comlicated for this post. So the libs are wrong.
