In many ways, it’s as bad for lgbtq+ people as it was in the 90s, especially trans kids. Suicide rates are sky high for these folks, and the bigotry is everywhere. It’s disgusting.
I think you mean to direct this comment to republican lawmakers who are ACTIVELY making lives worse for LGBTQ+ people. The president does not have legislative powers in this country. What do you expect the president to be able to do when the republican-run legislatures and courts have gone rogue? A proclamation here and there (literally he just did this), or an executive order (which he has signed multiple over the course of the administration). These however are easily undone by the other branches or government or by former president shitbag if he retakes the throne. I’m not sure how you can claim silence from the administration. Frustration with the whole situation, sure, but you can’t pin this on Biden.
I can’t pin it on Biden, but Democrats had the majority in the House and Senate for the first 2 years of his presidency. They had the opportunity to protect LGBTQ+ people. The catch is that they would have had to end the filibuster forever. They chose to protect the filibuster.
There was a majority in the House, and it was 50-50 in the Senate. With Harris being the tiebreaker, that’s a majority.
I also remember the line from 2022 being “If you want to pass things progressives are clamoring for, we need more Democrats.” So we elected an additional Democrat. Then Sinema left the party. Then Fetterman was like “Sucker!” and sprinted toward the center. And now Manchin has left the party.
So we need MORE Democrats. That’s the point. If you only give us a slim majority we’re beholden to the 2 or 3 blue dog conservative Dems. 2 additional progressives and we could have told Manchin and Sinema to pound sand.
2 additional progressives and we could have told Manchin and Sinema to pound sand.
Please. We elected an additional progressive in '22 and wound up with two fewer Democrats and the progressive we picked up turned out to be a centrist.
It doesn’t matter how big a majority we give Democrats. There are always just enough Manchins.
That’s absolutely not true. That one time you fickle fuckers gave us enough Democrats for like 4 months, we got Obamacare. Imagine what we could get with 4 years or so.
We gave Democrats a supermajority. They killed the public option with it. They made damned sure to bail out their owners in the banking industry and make sure the only one of them who saw any consequences was the guy who scammed rich people. And had no interest whatsoever in codifying Roe.
And just like Biden’s first two years, they could have ended the filibuster forever with a simple majority, so your “four months” argument is just another pro-failure excuse.
Although downvotes are not everything and maybe Lemmy skews one way.
I do have to ask, looking back now considering you got ratio’d. Do you take a look at your argument and see if perhaps you’re incorrect or just double down?
Not trying to call you out here. Just wondering how people with completely differing thoughts on a topic look back at them.
Clearly here it isn’t up for debate that Reps control the legislation and not the Democratic president, so your last comment is wild to me.
Only addressing your point on what downvotes mean as a reflection of understanding:
Idk about you, but I have had posts/ comments in the past that have had massive downvotes, but I also am confident in those takes because I’ve either studied them for my degree or I’m a professional in the field and have first hand experience. Sometimes the mob is wrong.
For instance, I am a music teacher, and understand how difficult it can be when two kids come to you crying after some incident, and while trying to manage a whole classroom I have to make a judgement call on who and how to discipline within 30 seconds. When I’ve said “hey I’m sorry your teacher punished you when you were the one bullied, but they also didn’t have the resources and frankly we’re not omnipotent, this is more of an issue administration has power over” I got down voted to hell.
That said, when my takes have consistently been downvoted to hell over a period of months, I would likely take a deeper dive. My degree was political science, and I had a harsh take on FDR, and while I still feel he’s a bit overrated, I recognize I was leaning into him deeper than needed.
No. “But it could be worse” is a stupid argument that glosses over a president that’s been pretty shitty in response to a tidal wave of hate towards the lgbtq community during his administration. And I’m not going to sit here and pretend otherwise.
And for anyone else who wants to pretend, that’s all you’re doing. Pretending
You’re missing the point. They’re pointing out that Biden, as shit as he is and genocide supporting, is literally powerless to pass laws with a Republican legislature. Like it is literally impossible, you see that right.
What’s proven to impossible? Do new laws never get passed.
The lives of the LGBTQ+ community is infinitely better than it was when I was growing up in the 90’s, that’s called progress and I for one am supportive of those changes. Sure we can do more, but pretending things have not improved is just crazy.
I’m not missing anything and this has nothing to do with genocide. He did more as VP by just standing up and speaking out. Now, he’s been practically silent.
And I don’t need apologists like you lecturing me on how the government works.
I’m not a centrist. I just don’t believe Biden should get credit where it’s not due. As vice president he engaged in plenty of LGBTQ advocacy. Not so much as president.
Well, yes, but there are a lot more people who support them. I feel like you can’t have a conversation without failed attempts at making me feel bad as a person.
(this reads like a rant but it’s a message of remembrance and reflection)
Rose-colored glasses? I remember my realization in the 90s and being in the closet for the entire 00s. Me and other queer peers were terrified of our own family, openly being mocked in school by students and faculty, I have friends that have attempted suicide more times than I have fingers per person. You should not know the ER staff on a first-name basis. Friends who didn’t reveal they were trans until they were in their 30s and separated from anyone but their closest, most trusted friends. Friends who still, after years of therapy, are still suffering from depression, anxiety, and suicidal thoughts. And this spreads wide with the people I grew up with. It’d actually genuinely be difficult to think of someone in my extended social circle that didn’t have the view that school was literal hell because of the constant belittling, insulting, second-class treatment from everyone from the students to the principal (I can think of literally just one individual). We had at least one person I know of who viewed the Columbine shooters as someone they looked up to, because of how badly they were treated at a place where you are supposed to be safe.
It’s not all rainbows and unicorns now, but it’s a stark contrast to what it was 20+ years ago. Children shouldn’t have to wonder if they are going to be stabbed or shot or beaten by so-called ‘adults’ and ‘caregivers’ for who they like. They shouldn’t be scared of being put out on the fucking street for taking their partner to prom. They shouldn’t have to create a second life of lies and then mirror that data around so if anyone questions anyone in the friend circle, the stories match up.
A child/teenager should be happy and joyous, not like a fucking prison sentence. 20 years ago, it was. I lived that hell, many of us did. Abuse everywhere you turned, even if you were still in the closet (to everyone but us). People were absolute terrible bastards, but the victims are changing that, because we are the people those fucks who call themselves adults should have been. Everyone I’ve spoken about is in a better place now - scarred physically, suffering from mental trauma, often still questioning why they don’t make today their last, every single day. But we are still here, we have always supported each other, and we want this hellhole to never be experienced by others ever again. A tall order, but we are trying.
I’m sure there’s thousands, shit, millions of others just like us. We are the shy, timid ones, boiling in our memories of bullshit, our permanent rage. Suffering one last time in the hopes that others don’t have to. Out in the world, some of us just want peace and quiet, to be left alone and forgotten, as their defense. Some carry weapons, due to their location and popular opinion against them. Some relocated to more accepting parts of the world, many right out of high school. But we all want all of us to live safer, happier, better lives. Together, we make progress, bit by bit.
My siblings and their friends, I hear them talk about things now and then. A few years makes a huge difference in tolerance - two decades might as well be completely different planets.
Just don’t pretend or romanticize years past, is all I’m saying. Progress is forward, not backward.
i was there too, like you and you’re forgetting that biden actively actively made the situation back in the 90’s and 00’s worse by voting against gay marriage; against gays in the military; and advocating against gays in federal service.
things got better in spite of biden et al. efforts; not because of them.
One that struck me is how Biden handled monkeypox. Under Trump, monkeypox would have been a “gay disease” that would have not been taken seriously at all. The Biden administration took it seriously and now I’ve completely forgotten it was a thing.
It’s a good thing he’s not going to be running for president 40 years ago, isn’t it? Unless you’re willing to make a blanket generalization that no one can change, maybe back way from the microphone.
Aww man, wish I caught that. Why didn’t the Biden administration help the LGBT community 40 years ago!? He really wasn’t a great president in 1984. /S
Look, his recent record shows the kind of administration he’s running, and what we could expect in the next 4 years. You may remember he (and Obama) said he believed marriage was between a man and a woman during the 2008 debates. Then, you may remember under the same administration, Gay marriage was federally legalized. It’s not like he’s going to go back to his pre-2008 stance in November.
Aww man, wish I caught that. Why didn’t the Biden administration help the LGBT community 40 years ago!? He really wasn’t a great president in 1984. /S
there were plenty of pro-gay politicians in 1984 and biden’s track record of actively making it worse is a 30 second google search away.
… You may remember he (and Obama) said he believed marriage was between a man and a woman during the 2008 debates. Then, you may remember under the same administration, Gay marriage was federally legalized…
gay marriage was made legal through the courts so it became legalized in spite of that administration; not because of it.
Wtf are you talking about? Do you not remember DOMA being repealed which was crucial for gay marriage to pass? Here is a quick list for you to use as evidence that the Obama administration was hostile to LGBTQ people.
Wtactualf are you talking about? Yes there were a handful, but being gay was ESPECIALLY a political death sentence then. Saying this just erases the fraught past we’ve had, and doesn’t recognize the INSANE amount of progress we’ve made.
Also if you read my comment you’d recognize that argument is moot, as his current administration is what is important.
You gotta go and audit your history YouTube channels. You’re getting some wacked info.
the obergefell v. hodges supreme court case made doma invalid. you’re thinking of the respect for marriage act which not only had no impact but allowed for people to legally protected if they rejected gay marriage.
hollywood and political agitators made that progress happen; while those people you’re supporting remained neutral at best and voted against it at the worst.
I posted an entire fucking list. The letters in blue will send you to another website with that list if you click it. It’s amazing what they’ve done for internet formatting these days.
your list only goes back 2.5 years; here’s a tip of the iceberg of a list that goes back MUCH longer with the first including a reference to a pro-gay politician in 1984:
thirsty is the right word; biden has spent all except the last 2.5 years as an influential anti-gay politician and hearing him called the most pro-gay president ever is heart breaking as someone who has had to live with his anti-gay policies and votes.
The problem with getting all your news from social media is that when you surround yourself with people who only share the one kind of news, you don’t get all of the other news that is very important.
As other people are saying to you, all you have to do is look for it and you will find a list of the pro-lgbt actions this administration has done.
The problem with getting all your news from social media is that when you surround yourself with people who only share the one kind of news, you don’t get all of the other news that is very important.
As other people are saying to you, all you have to do is look for it and you will find a list of the pro-lgbt actions this administration has done.
likewise, all you have to do is look for it and you’ll find a much longer list of biden’s anti-lgbt actions.
Weren’t you just criticizing someone for invalidating your experiences? That’s exactly what you’re doing right now to the person above.
If they say shit is much better for them and their loved ones right now, don’t say they’re just pretending that’s the case. If you want to be respected for saying things are personally no better for you, don’t tell someone else they’re just pretending if they say things are better for them now.
Otherwise you just come off as an incredibly disingenuous asshole.
Weren’t you just criticizing someone for invalidating your experiences?
No, that’s what you’re doing. Hypocrite.
What I was doing is calling out obvious, self-serving bullshit that has no evidentiary basis. I am not to blame if you are in capable of differentiating those two things. The pain you feel from such mental gymnastics? That’s an indication that you’re doing something unfit and wrong.
Take your irrational anger out on someone else. Start with those who are the blame, not just who is in front of you. That’s what children do.
You should take your own advice instead of screeching at everyone. I must admit though, you’re quite right, my head does hurt from reading your awful mental gymnastics.
Don’t you think your constant rage at everyone is a sign here that you’re doing something hypocritical and wrong?
I’m guessing probably not, but people have come to epiphanies of self growth from even less likely situations.
If you cannot exercise enough self-control to keep your mouth shut, I am not responsible for that.
You’re the one who’s posted two replies within a few minutes lmao
Regardless though, I thank you for your response. It isn’t often that someone proves of their own accord that they’re completely unhinged.
Feel free to keep responding though. You’re just proving the point further and further, and I doubt that’s going to end. Go ahead, keep projecting. I’m enjoying the free entertainment.
Your obsessive compulsion to keep digging in to an argument you lost hours ago is your fault, not mine
And I will continue pointing out this absurd, childish mistake, every time you stupidly reply.
You lost this argument, the moment you commented. Every comment you make henceforth is just a piteous plea for both attention, and your own redemption, neither of which will ever come
You’re the one who came here, with your crybaby tantrums, and spread your dirty diaper mess all over a rational conversation. Don’t blame me for your actions.
I am not to blame for your mental illness. If you cannot exercise enough self-control to keep your mouth shut, I am not responsible for that.
Oof I pressed a nerve, okay, let me rephrase. What you said doesn’t make sense because to anyone with half a brain at the time, being gay in the 90s was fucking awful. And that’s not a personal attack, a personal attack would be you sound like either a troll or delusional, and in either case you clearly have a poor grasp on your emotions judging from how defensive you got.
I don’t care if it makes sense to you, and honestly, that doesn’t matter. You came in hot, invalidating my experiences, and the things I have seen with my own eyes, basically calling me a liar. and unless you were there, by my side at that moment, you cannot fucking say that. Because you don’t fucking know.
I think you’re projecting, i came in with a mildly pointed response saying my opinion differed, you immediately became hostile, and judging from the rest of this thread it’s probably due to how much you’ve been arguing with people here about this. Honestly I think you should take a break from this thread, sleep on it, and come back tomorrow
Would you be willing to tell us about it? Why is life so much worse now than the period of stuff like the AIDS crisis, Section 28 and Romer v Evans… Before the widespread recognition and legalization of same sex marriage and the lowered barriers for trans people to change their identification documents that resulted.
I think you have people legitimately confused for your reasons because a lot of that history is painted as essentially a war and mass genocide by inaction primarily of lesbian, gay and bisexual people. While I know of a few of my trans elders have said that there was less individual heat on trans identities as there are now, it still doesn’t seem like on the whole it was a great time. People were still murdered for being trans and a lot of the fight for non-binary trans people were struggling with much deeper form of erasure.
I think people are concerned that what you are putting forward is your personal experience which may be narrower than the full encompassing experience of the entire LGBTQIA which it is assumed the question is being asked about. The birds eye veiw, of all the identities and the culture of the movement from that full ten year span. It’s generally assumed by younger people that most things are better now because at least we aren’t dropping like flies so it’s natural that the reaction to your opinion is disbelief.
*Edit, Removed an example event that was in the eighties.
The only incivility is your blaming victims for defending themselves. And for that, your hypocrisy is glaringly, obvious, you massive piece of fucking shit.
When you vote for Trump, know that I’m coming for you and your fascist kind
It always strikes me a strange that mods, like you don’t consider the incessant trolling to be incivil, only the self-defense to be incivil.
How much victim blaming can you stomach before you acknowledge you’re a disgusting hypocrite?
You are a vile piece of fucking shit. And I hope the van you give me as worth it, as you burn in the lake, a fucking fire, you goddamn piece of other diarrhea.
less than not much; he literally voted against gay marriage; gays in the military; and publicly supported banning gays from federal service.
then again he did sit and do nothing for decades to opportunistically switch sides to cash in on votes after we & hollywood worked our entire lives to change american hearts and minds on gay people.
I’ll second this question. I’ve seen a bunch of “hasn’t done enough” but it hasn’t been followed up with what that is. OP could you please share the solutions Biden has at his disposal that aren’t being executed?
I ask this as someone who is ignorant of those, not trying to argue.
The few times these fuckers bother to answer it’s always some vague “pressure the legislature” or “make a speech” or some other shit he’s already doing.
“If he just says mean words about them they’ll come around! So will Republicans! He just needs to loudly criticize him!”
“But he’s done that”
“HE’S NOT SAYING THE RIGHT MAGIC WORDS”
It’s quite interesting how it always comes down to this argument, that Biden just needs to be mean to Manchin and Sinema and then they’ll do everything that Biden says. Some extend the same logic to Republicans, which is just hilariously laughable.
Sorry I was out late last night got the start of Pride month.
Employment protections, housing protections, parental protections for adoption, enhance the hate crime bills, mental health access. Those are a start. Also needs universal healthcare, guaranteed housing, and other basic human rights.
Biden could have put massive pressure on his party to pass the Equality Act to safeguard the rights of people of any sexuality or gender. He could have done so fiercely and publicly, and campaigned in the home states of those like Manchin and Sinema to threaten their seats if they did not comply.
Dems, who just love their identity politics, could have been actual allies during the first 2 years of Biden’s presidency while they held the supermajority and passed this, but chose not to. Are you really surprised? For the second time in as many decades, they also chose not to codify Roe v Wade, and this time it cost us women’s bodily autonomy.
Biden could have put massive pressure on his party to pass the Equality Act to safeguard the rights of people of any sexuality or gender. He could have done so fiercely and publicly, and campaigned in the home states of those like Manchin and Sinema to threaten their seats if they did not comply.
Somehow I don’t think “be mean to them!” would’ve made them suddenly fall in line. I find so often that arguments get distilled down to this, that Biden just needs to say the right words and then everyone will agree with him.
That’s not how it works. If it was, Sanders would be president with a House and Senate that were 100% progressive. The uncomfortable fact is that there is no malicious self sabotage here – it just wasn’t possible.
Regarding Roe, there have never been 60 Democrat senators in favor of codifying Roe, or 50 Democrat senators willing to overturn the filibuster to codify it. Progressive senators needed to be elected, and weren’t. If everyone who wanted abortion to be an unalienable right went out and voted for a progressive senator in 2016, 2020, or 2022, it could’ve easily been passed. But people didn’t bother.
Perhaps those Senate candidates should’ve fiercely campaigned and denigrated pro abortion voters who refused to come out and vote? After all, you claim it’s a magic cure all strategy to get people to do what you want.
I honestly could not disagree with your assessment more.
There’s literally a term for this “being mean to them” - it’s called using the bully pulpit, and in our finest moments of federal progressive activism it has proven incredibly effective. Read into how FDR managed to deal with the obstructionist Dixiecrats to learn more about this tactic.
Quite conversely, Senator Sanders is widely regarded as too nice. He wasn’t willing to fully commit to attacking establishment democrats for their corrupt ways, and many consider this to be the real reason he didn’t capture the nomination.
Speaking of establishment corruption - Dems had the 60 seats during Obama’s first term and chose not to pursue Roe codification. They had months to do so before Kennedy died, and I assure you that legislation has been drafted and ready to go for decades. They just needed to vote on it, but chose not to in order to continue fear mongering and fund raising over abortion rights. More recently during Biden’s first term, they could have abolished the filibuster to pass it once the Supreme Court’s motivations became clear via the leaked memo, but again chose to do nothing. That’s the establishment DNC for you.
Lastly, bullying voters is a losing strategy Dems have employed since at least 2016.it didn’t work then, and it isn’t working now. Consider demanding leadership with conviction instead.
And what have you done, Joe?
Not much.
In many ways, it’s as bad for lgbtq+ people as it was in the 90s, especially trans kids. Suicide rates are sky high for these folks, and the bigotry is everywhere. It’s disgusting.
And you’re silent.
I think you mean to direct this comment to republican lawmakers who are ACTIVELY making lives worse for LGBTQ+ people. The president does not have legislative powers in this country. What do you expect the president to be able to do when the republican-run legislatures and courts have gone rogue? A proclamation here and there (literally he just did this), or an executive order (which he has signed multiple over the course of the administration). These however are easily undone by the other branches or government or by former president shitbag if he retakes the throne. I’m not sure how you can claim silence from the administration. Frustration with the whole situation, sure, but you can’t pin this on Biden.
biden was instrumental in getting us in this whole situation and only recently opportunistically switched sides to get votes.
I can’t pin it on Biden, but Democrats had the majority in the House and Senate for the first 2 years of his presidency. They had the opportunity to protect LGBTQ+ people. The catch is that they would have had to end the filibuster forever. They chose to protect the filibuster.
Are you sure? I thought it was just a slim majority in the house. At no point were both majority Dems.
There was a majority in the House, and it was 50-50 in the Senate. With Harris being the tiebreaker, that’s a majority.
I also remember the line from 2022 being “If you want to pass things progressives are clamoring for, we need more Democrats.” So we elected an additional Democrat. Then Sinema left the party. Then Fetterman was like “Sucker!” and sprinted toward the center. And now Manchin has left the party.
So we need MORE Democrats. That’s the point. If you only give us a slim majority we’re beholden to the 2 or 3 blue dog conservative Dems. 2 additional progressives and we could have told Manchin and Sinema to pound sand.
Please. We elected an additional progressive in '22 and wound up with two fewer Democrats and the progressive we picked up turned out to be a centrist.
It doesn’t matter how big a majority we give Democrats. There are always just enough Manchins.
So long as we perpetuate this system of legalized bribery, aka “campaign finance donations,” there will always be just enough Manchins.
Don’t forget the magic Senate parliamentarian
That’s absolutely not true. That one time you fickle fuckers gave us enough Democrats for like 4 months, we got Obamacare. Imagine what we could get with 4 years or so.
We gave Democrats a supermajority. They killed the public option with it. They made damned sure to bail out their owners in the banking industry and make sure the only one of them who saw any consequences was the guy who scammed rich people. And had no interest whatsoever in codifying Roe.
And just like Biden’s first two years, they could have ended the filibuster forever with a simple majority, so your “four months” argument is just another pro-failure excuse.
I know where I am directing my comment. I don’t need you to tell me.
Although downvotes are not everything and maybe Lemmy skews one way.
I do have to ask, looking back now considering you got ratio’d. Do you take a look at your argument and see if perhaps you’re incorrect or just double down?
Not trying to call you out here. Just wondering how people with completely differing thoughts on a topic look back at them.
Clearly here it isn’t up for debate that Reps control the legislation and not the Democratic president, so your last comment is wild to me.
Only addressing your point on what downvotes mean as a reflection of understanding:
Idk about you, but I have had posts/ comments in the past that have had massive downvotes, but I also am confident in those takes because I’ve either studied them for my degree or I’m a professional in the field and have first hand experience. Sometimes the mob is wrong.
For instance, I am a music teacher, and understand how difficult it can be when two kids come to you crying after some incident, and while trying to manage a whole classroom I have to make a judgement call on who and how to discipline within 30 seconds. When I’ve said “hey I’m sorry your teacher punished you when you were the one bullied, but they also didn’t have the resources and frankly we’re not omnipotent, this is more of an issue administration has power over” I got down voted to hell.
That said, when my takes have consistently been downvoted to hell over a period of months, I would likely take a deeper dive. My degree was political science, and I had a harsh take on FDR, and while I still feel he’s a bit overrated, I recognize I was leaning into him deeper than needed.
No. “But it could be worse” is a stupid argument that glosses over a president that’s been pretty shitty in response to a tidal wave of hate towards the lgbtq community during his administration. And I’m not going to sit here and pretend otherwise.
And for anyone else who wants to pretend, that’s all you’re doing. Pretending
You’re missing the point. They’re pointing out that Biden, as shit as he is and genocide supporting, is literally powerless to pass laws with a Republican legislature. Like it is literally impossible, you see that right.
it’s also proven to be impossible when democrats control the legislature; democrats aren’t the answer
What’s proven to impossible? Do new laws never get passed.
The lives of the LGBTQ+ community is infinitely better than it was when I was growing up in the 90’s, that’s called progress and I for one am supportive of those changes. Sure we can do more, but pretending things have not improved is just crazy.
things improved in spite of biden et al; not because of them.
I’m not missing anything and this has nothing to do with genocide. He did more as VP by just standing up and speaking out. Now, he’s been practically silent.
And I don’t need apologists like you lecturing me on how the government works.
Whatever dude.
Have a wonderful weekend.
Just because you’re not listening doesn’t mean he’s not speaking.
Centrists gonna centrist. They’re mad at reality. I’m the king of the downvotes in this sub haha
I’m not a centrist. I just don’t believe Biden should get credit where it’s not due. As vice president he engaged in plenty of LGBTQ advocacy. Not so much as president.
Things are bad right now, really bad, but they’re not as bad as they were in the 90s. Not even close.
That’s just how bad the 90s were.
Me, a gay teen in the 90s, being actually afraid for my life while holding the hand of my SO in public.
Now? I’ve got a fuckin’ flag.
People forget history when it works for them.
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How are they worse?
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Well, yes, but there are a lot more people who support them. I feel like you can’t have a conversation without failed attempts at making me feel bad as a person.
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Fwiw I’m a trans person who grew up in the 80s/90s and I still think the 90s were way WAY worse than present day for trans people.
NOT EVEN FUCKING CLOSE. Absolutely stupid take.
Tantrums and insults do not a cogent argument make.
Who’s having a tantrum?
It’s a stupid take. Objectively stupid.
Have a nice day!
I don’t know how many of their comments are still visible, but hoo boy. Tantrum is a mild way to put it. They’re utterly unhinged.
Change your diaper. I can smell it from here.
More conservative projection.
Then you shouldn’t project so much.
Or stop the childish name-calling just because someone presents facts that give you the BiG mAd.
President Biden has been absolute garbage towards the LGBTQ community during his term. That’s a fact.
You’ve confused me with the other guy that was winning your arguments. I haven’t called you a name.
link
Oh, look, you’re also a liar
(this reads like a rant but it’s a message of remembrance and reflection)
Rose-colored glasses? I remember my realization in the 90s and being in the closet for the entire 00s. Me and other queer peers were terrified of our own family, openly being mocked in school by students and faculty, I have friends that have attempted suicide more times than I have fingers per person. You should not know the ER staff on a first-name basis. Friends who didn’t reveal they were trans until they were in their 30s and separated from anyone but their closest, most trusted friends. Friends who still, after years of therapy, are still suffering from depression, anxiety, and suicidal thoughts. And this spreads wide with the people I grew up with. It’d actually genuinely be difficult to think of someone in my extended social circle that didn’t have the view that school was literal hell because of the constant belittling, insulting, second-class treatment from everyone from the students to the principal (I can think of literally just one individual). We had at least one person I know of who viewed the Columbine shooters as someone they looked up to, because of how badly they were treated at a place where you are supposed to be safe.
It’s not all rainbows and unicorns now, but it’s a stark contrast to what it was 20+ years ago. Children shouldn’t have to wonder if they are going to be stabbed or shot or beaten by so-called ‘adults’ and ‘caregivers’ for who they like. They shouldn’t be scared of being put out on the fucking street for taking their partner to prom. They shouldn’t have to create a second life of lies and then mirror that data around so if anyone questions anyone in the friend circle, the stories match up.
A child/teenager should be happy and joyous, not like a fucking prison sentence. 20 years ago, it was. I lived that hell, many of us did. Abuse everywhere you turned, even if you were still in the closet (to everyone but us). People were absolute terrible bastards, but the victims are changing that, because we are the people those fucks who call themselves adults should have been. Everyone I’ve spoken about is in a better place now - scarred physically, suffering from mental trauma, often still questioning why they don’t make today their last, every single day. But we are still here, we have always supported each other, and we want this hellhole to never be experienced by others ever again. A tall order, but we are trying.
I’m sure there’s thousands, shit, millions of others just like us. We are the shy, timid ones, boiling in our memories of bullshit, our permanent rage. Suffering one last time in the hopes that others don’t have to. Out in the world, some of us just want peace and quiet, to be left alone and forgotten, as their defense. Some carry weapons, due to their location and popular opinion against them. Some relocated to more accepting parts of the world, many right out of high school. But we all want all of us to live safer, happier, better lives. Together, we make progress, bit by bit.
My siblings and their friends, I hear them talk about things now and then. A few years makes a huge difference in tolerance - two decades might as well be completely different planets.
Just don’t pretend or romanticize years past, is all I’m saying. Progress is forward, not backward.
i was there too, like you and you’re forgetting that biden actively actively made the situation back in the 90’s and 00’s worse by voting against gay marriage; against gays in the military; and advocating against gays in federal service.
things got better in spite of biden et al. efforts; not because of them.
I’m not the one pretending here. No progress has been made during this administration.
My brother in christ it takes literally one Google search to see how utter bullshit this take is.
https://www.hrc.org/resources/president-bidens-pro-lgbtq-timeline
One that struck me is how Biden handled monkeypox. Under Trump, monkeypox would have been a “gay disease” that would have not been taken seriously at all. The Biden administration took it seriously and now I’ve completely forgotten it was a thing.
Go take your lunch break Dimitri.
his pro gay “history” only goes back 2.5 years. lol
while his any-gay history goes back 40+ years
It’s a good thing he’s not going to be running for president 40 years ago, isn’t it? Unless you’re willing to make a blanket generalization that no one can change, maybe back way from the microphone.
he literally tried to multiple times back then. lol
So? Tell me how that has anything to do with now?
it shows that he has no real principles and is just a politician who only cares about getting votes to maintain the status quo
Aww man, wish I caught that. Why didn’t the Biden administration help the LGBT community 40 years ago!? He really wasn’t a great president in 1984. /S
Look, his recent record shows the kind of administration he’s running, and what we could expect in the next 4 years. You may remember he (and Obama) said he believed marriage was between a man and a woman during the 2008 debates. Then, you may remember under the same administration, Gay marriage was federally legalized. It’s not like he’s going to go back to his pre-2008 stance in November.
there were plenty of pro-gay politicians in 1984 and biden’s track record of actively making it worse is a 30 second google search away.
gay marriage was made legal through the courts so it became legalized in spite of that administration; not because of it.
Wtf are you talking about? Do you not remember DOMA being repealed which was crucial for gay marriage to pass? Here is a quick list for you to use as evidence that the Obama administration was hostile to LGBTQ people.
https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/the-press-office/2016/06/09/fact-sheet-obama-administrations-record-and-lgbt-community
Wtactualf are you talking about? Yes there were a handful, but being gay was ESPECIALLY a political death sentence then. Saying this just erases the fraught past we’ve had, and doesn’t recognize the INSANE amount of progress we’ve made.
Also if you read my comment you’d recognize that argument is moot, as his current administration is what is important.
You gotta go and audit your history YouTube channels. You’re getting some wacked info.
the obergefell v. hodges supreme court case made doma invalid. you’re thinking of the respect for marriage act which not only had no impact but allowed for people to legally protected if they rejected gay marriage.
hollywood and political agitators made that progress happen; while those people you’re supporting remained neutral at best and voted against it at the worst.
What does that have to do with now?
it means that he only does the things that will get him votes
Christ is a myth, and if you think a single example in 4 years is anything impressive, it just proves how thirsty you are.
I posted an entire fucking list. The letters in blue will send you to another website with that list if you click it. It’s amazing what they’ve done for internet formatting these days.
Don’t bother, he’s one of the many trolls whose entire purpose on Lemmy is to shit on biden
your list only goes back 2.5 years; here’s a tip of the iceberg of a list that goes back MUCH longer with the first including a reference to a pro-gay politician in 1984:
biden voted against gay marriage
biden voted against gays in the military
biden affirmed his stance on anti-gay marriage in 2006
biden supported banning gays in federal service eg executive order 10450
Man you keep missing the point of looking at the current administration.
Go take your break before Putin sends you to the gulag.
i hope you enjoy your blue-maga kool-aid
thirsty is the right word; biden has spent all except the last 2.5 years as an influential anti-gay politician and hearing him called the most pro-gay president ever is heart breaking as someone who has had to live with his anti-gay policies and votes.
The problem with getting all your news from social media is that when you surround yourself with people who only share the one kind of news, you don’t get all of the other news that is very important.
As other people are saying to you, all you have to do is look for it and you will find a list of the pro-lgbt actions this administration has done.
likewise, all you have to do is look for it and you’ll find a much longer list of biden’s anti-lgbt actions.
Name one.
biden voted against gay marriage
Good thing one single person isn’t running the country. What has he done while president?
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how about enabling and turning a blind eye to an ongoing genocide?
or failing to make good on his campaign promises while he and his party was in control of both the house & senate?
or weaponizing the law to force striking workers to get back to work?
or banning a social media company and cheap electric cars to please his aipac and automotive donors and using the guise of national security to do so?
So easy to find that you couldn’t.
Lmgtfy
Weren’t you just criticizing someone for invalidating your experiences? That’s exactly what you’re doing right now to the person above.
If they say shit is much better for them and their loved ones right now, don’t say they’re just pretending that’s the case. If you want to be respected for saying things are personally no better for you, don’t tell someone else they’re just pretending if they say things are better for them now.
Otherwise you just come off as an incredibly disingenuous asshole.
No, that’s what you’re doing. Hypocrite.
What I was doing is calling out obvious, self-serving bullshit that has no evidentiary basis. I am not to blame if you are in capable of differentiating those two things. The pain you feel from such mental gymnastics? That’s an indication that you’re doing something unfit and wrong.
Take your irrational anger out on someone else. Start with those who are the blame, not just who is in front of you. That’s what children do.
You should take your own advice instead of screeching at everyone. I must admit though, you’re quite right, my head does hurt from reading your awful mental gymnastics.
Don’t you think your constant rage at everyone is a sign here that you’re doing something hypocritical and wrong?
I’m guessing probably not, but people have come to epiphanies of self growth from even less likely situations.
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Repeated civility breaches. You need to go touch grass.
You’re the one who’s posted two replies within a few minutes lmao
Regardless though, I thank you for your response. It isn’t often that someone proves of their own accord that they’re completely unhinged.
Feel free to keep responding though. You’re just proving the point further and further, and I doubt that’s going to end. Go ahead, keep projecting. I’m enjoying the free entertainment.
Your obsessive compulsion to keep digging in to an argument you lost hours ago is your fault, not mine
And I will continue pointing out this absurd, childish mistake, every time you stupidly reply.
You lost this argument, the moment you commented. Every comment you make henceforth is just a piteous plea for both attention, and your own redemption, neither of which will ever come
You’re the one who came here, with your crybaby tantrums, and spread your dirty diaper mess all over a rational conversation. Don’t blame me for your actions.
I am not to blame for your mental illness. If you cannot exercise enough self-control to keep your mouth shut, I am not responsible for that.
My man, did you live in the 90’s? Cause it kinda sounds like you don’t know what you’re talking about
I did. Don’t tell me what I did and didn’t see or live through.
How arrogant and presumptuous of you to think you could presume my entire life experience from a few internet comments.
Oh, and making personal attacks to further your position just highlights how weak your argument is.
Oof I pressed a nerve, okay, let me rephrase. What you said doesn’t make sense because to anyone with half a brain at the time, being gay in the 90s was fucking awful. And that’s not a personal attack, a personal attack would be you sound like either a troll or delusional, and in either case you clearly have a poor grasp on your emotions judging from how defensive you got.
I don’t care if it makes sense to you, and honestly, that doesn’t matter. You came in hot, invalidating my experiences, and the things I have seen with my own eyes, basically calling me a liar. and unless you were there, by my side at that moment, you cannot fucking say that. Because you don’t fucking know.
Check yourself
I think you’re projecting, i came in with a mildly pointed response saying my opinion differed, you immediately became hostile, and judging from the rest of this thread it’s probably due to how much you’ve been arguing with people here about this. Honestly I think you should take a break from this thread, sleep on it, and come back tomorrow
No, you’re just blaming me for your inability to consider another point of view that may in fact be better supported by the evidence than your own.
That’s just called denial. Don’t blame me for your own ability to cope with the reality of the situation. That’s on you.
Would you be willing to tell us about it? Why is life so much worse now than the period of stuff like the AIDS crisis, Section 28 and Romer v Evans… Before the widespread recognition and legalization of same sex marriage and the lowered barriers for trans people to change their identification documents that resulted.
I think you have people legitimately confused for your reasons because a lot of that history is painted as essentially a war and mass genocide by inaction primarily of lesbian, gay and bisexual people. While I know of a few of my trans elders have said that there was less individual heat on trans identities as there are now, it still doesn’t seem like on the whole it was a great time. People were still murdered for being trans and a lot of the fight for non-binary trans people were struggling with much deeper form of erasure.
I think people are concerned that what you are putting forward is your personal experience which may be narrower than the full encompassing experience of the entire LGBTQIA which it is assumed the question is being asked about. The birds eye veiw, of all the identities and the culture of the movement from that full ten year span. It’s generally assumed by younger people that most things are better now because at least we aren’t dropping like flies so it’s natural that the reaction to your opinion is disbelief.
*Edit, Removed an example event that was in the eighties.
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Ookay… That is a very outsized violent reaction. I think you may have had a bit too much internet for one day.
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Removed, civility.
The only incivility is your blaming victims for defending themselves. And for that, your hypocrisy is glaringly, obvious, you massive piece of fucking shit.
When you vote for Trump, know that I’m coming for you and your fascist kind
Removed, civility.
It always strikes me a strange that mods, like you don’t consider the incessant trolling to be incivil, only the self-defense to be incivil.
How much victim blaming can you stomach before you acknowledge you’re a disgusting hypocrite?
You are a vile piece of fucking shit. And I hope the van you give me as worth it, as you burn in the lake, a fucking fire, you goddamn piece of other diarrhea.
less than not much; he literally voted against gay marriage; gays in the military; and publicly supported banning gays from federal service.
then again he did sit and do nothing for decades to opportunistically switch sides to cash in on votes after we & hollywood worked our entire lives to change american hearts and minds on gay people.
Over 300 anti LGBTQ laws passed by republicans and Dems haven’t done shit to counter them. Hollow, meaningless rhetoric doesn’t save lives.
Examples?
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Anything after 2020?
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Mostly Republican from the looks of it. None of them related to Biden because they are state laws.
I’m not defending him. I’m stopping misinformation.
You can crap on Biden all you want. Just don’t make shit up.
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He’s done the bare minimum, at least. Could do a whole lot more Joe but… he won’t.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2024/05/31/a-proclamation-on-lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-queer-and-intersex-pride-month-2024/
What do you think he could do?
I’ll second this question. I’ve seen a bunch of “hasn’t done enough” but it hasn’t been followed up with what that is. OP could you please share the solutions Biden has at his disposal that aren’t being executed?
I ask this as someone who is ignorant of those, not trying to argue.
Crickets lol
The few times these fuckers bother to answer it’s always some vague “pressure the legislature” or “make a speech” or some other shit he’s already doing.
“If he just says mean words about them they’ll come around! So will Republicans! He just needs to loudly criticize him!”
“But he’s done that”
“HE’S NOT SAYING THE RIGHT MAGIC WORDS”
It’s quite interesting how it always comes down to this argument, that Biden just needs to be mean to Manchin and Sinema and then they’ll do everything that Biden says. Some extend the same logic to Republicans, which is just hilariously laughable.
Sorry I was out late last night got the start of Pride month.
Employment protections, housing protections, parental protections for adoption, enhance the hate crime bills, mental health access. Those are a start. Also needs universal healthcare, guaranteed housing, and other basic human rights.
Could you explain what specific actions Biden could take to achieve these without needing Congress?
You’re right. Joe Biden can’t do anything whatsoever. The end.
Biden could have put massive pressure on his party to pass the Equality Act to safeguard the rights of people of any sexuality or gender. He could have done so fiercely and publicly, and campaigned in the home states of those like Manchin and Sinema to threaten their seats if they did not comply.
Dems, who just love their identity politics, could have been actual allies during the first 2 years of Biden’s presidency while they held the supermajority and passed this, but chose not to. Are you really surprised? For the second time in as many decades, they also chose not to codify Roe v Wade, and this time it cost us women’s bodily autonomy.
Somehow I don’t think “be mean to them!” would’ve made them suddenly fall in line. I find so often that arguments get distilled down to this, that Biden just needs to say the right words and then everyone will agree with him.
That’s not how it works. If it was, Sanders would be president with a House and Senate that were 100% progressive. The uncomfortable fact is that there is no malicious self sabotage here – it just wasn’t possible.
Regarding Roe, there have never been 60 Democrat senators in favor of codifying Roe, or 50 Democrat senators willing to overturn the filibuster to codify it. Progressive senators needed to be elected, and weren’t. If everyone who wanted abortion to be an unalienable right went out and voted for a progressive senator in 2016, 2020, or 2022, it could’ve easily been passed. But people didn’t bother.
Perhaps those Senate candidates should’ve fiercely campaigned and denigrated pro abortion voters who refused to come out and vote? After all, you claim it’s a magic cure all strategy to get people to do what you want.
I honestly could not disagree with your assessment more.
There’s literally a term for this “being mean to them” - it’s called using the bully pulpit, and in our finest moments of federal progressive activism it has proven incredibly effective. Read into how FDR managed to deal with the obstructionist Dixiecrats to learn more about this tactic.
Quite conversely, Senator Sanders is widely regarded as too nice. He wasn’t willing to fully commit to attacking establishment democrats for their corrupt ways, and many consider this to be the real reason he didn’t capture the nomination.
Speaking of establishment corruption - Dems had the 60 seats during Obama’s first term and chose not to pursue Roe codification. They had months to do so before Kennedy died, and I assure you that legislation has been drafted and ready to go for decades. They just needed to vote on it, but chose not to in order to continue fear mongering and fund raising over abortion rights. More recently during Biden’s first term, they could have abolished the filibuster to pass it once the Supreme Court’s motivations became clear via the leaked memo, but again chose to do nothing. That’s the establishment DNC for you.
Lastly, bullying voters is a losing strategy Dems have employed since at least 2016.it didn’t work then, and it isn’t working now. Consider demanding leadership with conviction instead.
he’s done worse than the bare minimum; he’s actively made it worse until 2.5 years ago.