The share of Republicans and Republican-leaning independents who believe that President Joe Biden’s 2020 election win was not legitimate has ticked back up, according to a new CNN poll fielded throughout July. All told, 69% of Republicans and Republican-leaners say Biden’s win was not legitimate, up from 63% earlier this year and through last fall, even as there is no evidence of election fraud that would have altered the outcome of the contest.
The really shocking thing here is that 31% of Republicans are still aware of reality enough to understand that Biden won legitimately.
Like 70% also believe angels are real…
Apparently decades of No Child Left Behind and removing critical thinking from public education did what republicans wanted it to do
You’re assuming they actually believe what they are saying and are arguing in good faith. That hasn’t been in the Republican playbook since at least Nixon.
Not to defend No Child Left Behind but it was only a 2002 law, the majority of these people are too old to have been in school since its passage.
Normalize questioning random ideas about politics people toss out
Yes but that change affected anyone in school at the time as well. No Child Left Behind touched the schooling of people up to the age of 38. That’s roughly half of Americans. You would need to remove people not of voting age, but the impact is still huge.
It was repealed & replaced in 2015 anyway so it was only in effect for 13 years and over half of states had waivers for it by then anyway. Once again not defending the state of public education or laws passed affecting it, just making sure we all know the facts.
But if it wasn’t for that, republicans wouldn’t be getting elected still…
Obviously I didn’t mean the only people who believe this shit is the kids from No Child, mostly because red states were already doing it on a state level.
But there’s enough of them that it’s keeping republicans in office where they wouldn’t be without it.
Very very few problems have a single cause, again, I thought that was so obvious it wouldn’t need to be explained. But here we are…
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Don’t worry, they’re fixing this by burning books. We’ll be back to the 50’s in no time!
You act like it’s limited to the younger generations of Republicans.
Doesn’t help that they are allowing Trump to run around the country to continue to say he was cheated and that the election was stolen. They are literally waiting until next year to even put him on trial.
Plenty of time for him to cause as much harm as possible.
Those 30% will still vote R, even after knowing that they have been lied to by the republicans.
When republicans voters call others “cucks”, you know it’s all a projection.
They’ve largely stopped using “cuck” as an insult since the high mark of their movement involved a guy wearin’ horns.
Or they’re just embarrassed to admit what they really think.
Are they capable of shame? Seems like they revel in the absolute worst behavior possible.
now do the % of repubs who think the earth is 5,000 years old. or the % that think russia is our ally.
The Republican Party has become a doctrinaire anti-American organization; wholly subservient to the international fascist movement.
Why would any loyal American patriot be a member of it?
The Republicans stand against what America actually is.
The USA is a multicultural society. The Republicans are against that.
The USA is a leader in science; including the understanding of our planet’s climate. The Republicans are against that.
The USA is loyal to its international allies. The Republicans are against that.
The USA is committed to freedom of speech and of the press. The Republicans are against that.
The USA is a leader in technology; including the development of clean energy. The Republicans are against that.
The USA is a secular society, in which people of different religions can meet as equals in the marketplace of ideas. The Republicans are against that.
The USA is a capitalist economy; in which businesses may prosper without having to bend the knee to leaders’ personality-cults or their ideological doctrine. The Republicans are against that.
The USA is an educated society; with free schooling for all, and with some of the best universities in the world. The Republicans are against that.
In all of these ways, the Republicans have endorsed anti-Americanism — opposition to what the USA actually is, its actual strengths and virtues.
It’s scary when there’s an entire echochamber yelling nonsense at the top of their lungs. How is America supposed to recover with this incessant Fox News and even worse OAN propaganda?
The obvious solution is to outlaw intentionally lying in the guise of a news show. Make FOX etc., have to broadcast a banner that says, “THIS IS NOT FACTUAL NEWS THIS IS FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES ONLY,” as they have argued in court.
In addition to this, retractions and corrections need to be more prominent. No more screaming falsehoods for hours and days and then quietly issuing a retraction as a scroll during the low viewership time block.
Make FOX etc., have to broadcast a banner that says, “THIS IS NOT FACTUAL NEWS THIS IS FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES ONLY,"
I mean, that might work, but what we’d get is "THIS IS NOT FACTUAL NEWS THIS IS FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES ONLY 😉 " and there’d be no difference to what we have now.
True, some people still believe the Weekly World News is real and it has such a disclaimer. I would like people who believe Fox News to be considered crackpots of a similar caliber. I think such a disclaimer might accomplish this. At very least it would save us from having to refute their fire-hose of bullshit, as it says right on the screen that it’s bullshit, no outside citation needed.
Either that or it’ll force them to improve their journalistic standards to get rid of the disclaimer. Either way, a win.
Fox would own the fuck out of that.
The left makes us put this banner on here! We know you’re smart people that can make your own choices about what is and is not “entertainment”! Now, for something I don’t find at all entertaining, Biden once again oversteps his authority and …
The left makes us put this banner on here!
That argument might make sense if it wasn’t Fox themselves arguing in court that they aren’t presenting news and can therefore lie without consequence because shows like Tucker Carlson are entertainment.
I understand completely that it makes no sense that their viewers are this stupid, but it also doesn’t change the fact that they are.
Align them with the crazies. If you hold these beliefs then you think the earth is flat. Full stop.
If someone mentions this shit then they obviously believe in hollow earth, lizard people shit. Laugh at them, call them out as laughable and do not treat them as a serious person. They are talking about nonsense and they are children. Treat them as such.
This just in: republicans are fucking insane
If you are a republican in this day and age, given ALL the shit they have done and what they stand for, you are either stupid, evil or both
But yet we still have to navigate this and them, despite their terrible brain problems.
you are either stupid, evil or both
Republican leadership is mostly both, and it is done with the idea of keeping their voting base stupid. Smart, moral people don’t vote republican at least since Reagan. The only thing Republican leadership believes in is money and power, and you have to keep people pretty dumb in order to keep believing the lies that Republican policies are good for anyone but the rich. So you get a DeSantis, for example, who’s stripping libraries and destroying education in his state because it’s the only hope that he has in keeping power. It’s why Republican talking points are all about “woke” because they don’t have to define it and they can’t actually point to like a single fucking thing they’re doing that’s bettering anyone’s lives.
They’re also listening to news sources that promote the bullshit instead of relaying actual facts. It’s no wonder they don’t know what’s going on.
Remember when democrats cried for 4 years about “muh Russia interference”?
Remember it was shown that it was fabricated by Clinton?
Remember when they found nothing in connection to Russia even though all they did was try and get him on something?
This is “democracy” is it?
Orange man said mean tweets so now we much fortify and make sure we only have our guys as leaders lol
No I don’t remember. Got any proof/ sauce for this bullshit you’re peddling?
Here is what I remember: “So the report documents the extensive connections between folks in the Trump campaign and Russia, some of which we already knew. But it goes into greater depth, most notably probably on Paul Manafort.”
Republican voters are a different breed. Even with enough evidence to prove Russia was interfering with the 2016 election, Democrats still mostly accepted the win. With even less evidence of any fraud in the 2020 election, the majority of Republicans deny Biden’s legitimacy.
With ZERO evidence. Not “Even less”. There was ZERO evidence of fraud by the Biden campaign and democrats.
And lots of evidence of Republicans committing fraud in 2020, and still they lost.
They take their cues from their politicians who are all cowards. Every Republican politician with even the most basic critical thinking skills understands that Trump did not win and that Trump intentionally broke the law with classified documents.
Instead of acknowledging those facts, they instead are literally willing to destroy Americans’ faith in fair elections and the basic rule of law by spewing lies in an effort to prostrate themselves to Donald Trump and his supporters. They have no fundamental principles anymore. They are literally willing to burn the country down to win.
Democrats still mostly accepted the win
I couldn’t view your link, but yes majority of Democrats did accept it: https://news.gallup.com/poll/197441/accept-trump-legitimate-president.aspx
This includes Biden himself who requested that his party accept the results. https://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/no-trump-electoral-college-challenge-233294
I provided actual poll results and news articles. Not to mention the overriding news of actual indictments handed down by the DOJ.
You provided a tweet of a 10 minute cherry picked montage video.
I think I’m going to go with reality, thank you.
Your polls contradict the actual message, that’s not reality
As a conservative, this is mind boggling to me. In my head I think it’s just a far right crazy conspiracy theory, but between this and the huge amount of support trump gets, I’m just baffled. I’m on the west coast, and none of my friends or family still support Trump or are election deniers.
Maybe the mid west republicans are just 100% trumpers? It’s wild.
Maybe the mid west republicans are just 100% trumpers? It’s wild.
MAGA is basically like a religion out here. They avoid any information that contradicts their belief system and gravitate towards media that reaffirms it. The constant drumbeat of whataboutism coming from trump, fox news, AM radio, etc really has poisoned their brains. Support of trump, embrace of his lies, and hatred of his “enemies”, has become their entire identity.
This isn’t so much a mystery, but more of a reaping of what was sown.
Right Wing media sources such as Breitbart and Fox News, have been nurturing many lines of thought, mostly in order to fire up the conservative base, versus providing useful information.
When you want your base to be an angry mob, and spend considerable resources to keep them angry, ill informed, but likely to vote, this is what you get.
This is a well trained response.
In light of seeing your fellow conservatives move farther right (and thus, kinda push the definition of the body of conservative beliefs farther right), on what grounds do you still identify as conservative? What does being a conservative mean to you?
(and thus, kinda push the definition of the body of conservative beliefs farther right)
I don’t really agree with this. The republican party shifting doesn’t mean the ideals of conservative ideology changes.
On the other side of the coin, just because democrats are starting to become more socialist, does that mean that liberal ideologies are changing?
I’m still a conservative because I believe in tradition, I believe in small government and a country that abides by the constitution is the best way to govern. I believe in the free market and put more emphasis on a states individuality rather than having a large federal government.
The “other side of the coin” in this instance is a fiction. The Democratic Party is in no meaningful sense of the word becoming “socialist”.
The Democratic Party is in no meaningful sense of the word becoming “socialist”.
They have self proclaimed socialists in office, and I have a self proclaimed communist on my city council.
You’re saying that socialists in this country are fiction because they don’t know about it? I’m confused your stance.
They’re saying that, as a party, it’s absurd to think the democratic party is becoming more socialist. For decades now, it has been a big tent party of not-crazy and stupid assholes. If anything, it moved startlingly rightwards for years as it absorbed more and more not-crazy and stupid assholes from the other side. Every now and then, there is a punctuated moment where single elements of single policies might represent a brief skip leftwards and here and there you have examples of individual members claiming to be socialist, communist, fucking whatever. But it’s foolish to think that’s representative of the party as a whole.
I’ll need any source you can provide to back what you’re saying up. Here is a list of socialists in office, and as you can see, there are more now than any point in history in the U.S.
As a non-american, the idea that the Democrats are becoming more socialist is hilarious. At best, they’re getting closer to the centre (from the right). Lemme know when they start proposing an end to health profiteering and stronger union protections :P
This is not a hostile comment, hats off to you for being able to talk openly about your ideas and hear differening opinions 🎩
Democracies around the world really need more of that.
And socialist countries are far right to communist countries, that’s why we don’t compare our political parties internationally.
There are more socialists currently representing people from the democratic party than ever before, and the party is moving more socialist, those are facts. Are you arguing against that?
I think many are simply arguing against your unconventional use of the term “socialist” to describe politicians who are definitely not socialist.
Well it seems that they have a problem with the democratic party incorrectly using the term socialist. They have been for awhile, they call scandinavian countries socialist when they’re not at all. If some democrats claim they’re socialists, and run on a socialist platform, I’ll call them socialist.
I suspect conservative people like yourself no longer identifying as Republican may be a factor.
I have a couple former republican friends who are still very conservative, but aren’t trumpers and voted libertarian or independent last election.
They do still have a bit of distrust around Jan 6th and criminal allegations because, well, they avoid looking into them deeper, so don’t know who to trust. But they’re not foaming at the mouth.
They love him in the southeast. I’m in VA which is purple and not even in a rural area, and he has tons of support here.
I was behind a truck the other day with a decal covering the back window stating the following:
“Me and my homies would have been stacking bodies by now. – George Washington”
They’re fucking crazy and they’re everywhere around here. It makes my blood boil.
Even just north of y’all in Western MD where I recently vacated from, there are plenty of nutters. MD is seen as a pretty blue state but that’s mostly just Baltimore and Montgomery County balancing out the crazy in the rest of the state. The more rural parts of the state are still full to the brim of your typical Trump wackos.
It’s not just a mid-west thing. I’m in the PNW and I’ve yet to meet a Never Trumper republican.
I am pretty liberal, but I have a-lot of family members who are republican and live in the midwest and they feel like they’re in the same boat as you.
I do have to wonder where he gets all his support.
Maybe now. The Republicans in my family left the party after 2016. Granted, they’re still on my shit list for voting against LGBT stuff but at least they’ve recognized the error of their ways.
What anti-lgbt stuff did they vote against?
They voted for the Party that hates gay people. That’s enough for me.
Hahah, see how quickly you back down from your comment?
‘well, I lied before, but they might as well have!! Therefore, SHITLIST!’
Go ahead, tell me who they voted for that they’re on your shit list because they vote differently than you do.
I didn’t back down. They voted for Trump in 2016. The GOP platform is explicitly anti gay. Had my step dad voted for Trump in 2020 he wouldn’t be invited to my gay wedding because Republicans want to overturn Obergafell.
I don’t care who you vote for as long as they support gay rights.
I didn’t lie. You just can’t read.
I’m a single issue voter and that issue is queer rights.
Most midwest Republicans are actually populists, and populism is step one on the track to fascism. They have been used and abused by large corporations killing off local economies and greater macroeconomic forces which have determined that their labor is no longer worth a living wage. It’s quite sad actually, but at this point the damage has been done. There’s nothing left for reasonable people to do but get out.
Coming from the southeast, definitely still a lot of Trump banners and bumper stickers, though less so now. I expect them to be more common as the election gets closer.
Hard to call it far right anymore. Conspiracy theorists and hate are more or less the norm in conservative circles, so far as I can tell.
the conservative party is gone. What’s left is a theocratic loony bid. Anyone voting for that shit is completely out of the loop or doesn’t care about the negative long term consequences to their continued science and data denial and constant conspiracy theory horseshit.
Yeah I’m telling you. There is an older crowd that it doesn’t matter what you say to them, they run on hate and they’ve been given a lot of fuel.
Remember the 2000 election? That was a close one. One county in one state with a 500 vote difference. 2020 were 5 states with 10k votes in Arizona to 180k votes in Pennsylvania to Biden. If they pulled 13k votes for out of Trump’s ass for AZ and GA he would of still would of lost the election. They key to the White House is the rust belt. Republicans are too dumb to understand this.
500 votes in a state that was governed by the winners brother, no less.
Democrats have good reason to be suspect about 2000. Republicans are a bunch of clowns.
Yes my point is that 2000 is a valid reason to be suspicious. But you don’t see Gore kicking the results back to Florida and have them overturn the election results with fake electors. That’s fraud.
So, 69% of Republicans are traitors to the Republic. That’s what I’m hearing.
How many of those 70% knows it’s a lie, but went along with it. There’s a reason why I support rejecting Republicans and I would go as far as not funding red states along with boycotting businesses residing from those states.
That would backfire spectacularly. We must always keep in mind that Republican policies keep their citizens in a state of disinformation and dilapidation. If your life is already miserable, denied education and resources so as to never escape what few jobs are left, you’ll latch onto anyone promising salvation. That is the whole reason we saw J6ers go as far as they did.
The long road has the best chances of keeping the country in one piece. Dispelling falsehoods piece by piece, enacting programs that modernize not just infrastructure but local economies as well. Bring the success of the coasts inward to lands exploited and abandoned by corporations and their elected goons. As difficult as it sounds, we’re looking at another reconstruction era for those kneecapped by decades of Republican control.
I also support the rising tides raise all boats approach. There is so much hate for these poor, white, uneducated, disenfranchised swaths of middle America. It is too easy to just say they deserve what they get, instead of dragging them (kicking and screaming I might add) into the 21st century. Even if many of them are a lost cause, we shouldn’t be so keen on throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
I see no realistic solution that does not include fighting Republicans for the hearts and minds of the average working class American. This is why Democrats continue to struggle even with overwhelming statistical advantages. The corporatist wing of the Democrats continue to block the kind of New Deal, Social Democracy, Keystone policies that actually win elections.
You change the material conditions of millions of people, and see how fast they jump on board. Most people cannot see the forest through the trees when they are drowning in the inevitability of automation and skilled labor killing their livelihood. We need to force the Democrats to take bold action to better the lives of the whole country, or we will suffer the consequences of political inaction. It starts with the local first. The bottom up, grassroots approach can work. It just takes time, determination, and a desire to refocus the agenda away from culture war naval gazing and onto real world solutions.
Keep fighting the good fight!
Always has been.
Does no one remember 2016-2020? The whole time people said Trumps win was a sham.
Are those people traitors too?
I’m not saying Biden’s win was bullshit, but I swear no one can remember past 30 minutes ago
It’s not the same. Most people calling the 2016 election a sham will admit that Trump did technically win by the rules as written, but also think that those rules are bullshit because they allowed a multi-million person majority to be shut out in favor of a malevolent moron. The people saying Biden lost are saying he literally cheated and that there’s a conspiracy of thousands of government employees collaborating to break the rules and subvert the will of the people; that the multi-million majority literally doesn’t exist. This is just as disingenuous as comparing the top secret documents that Trump hid to the ones that Biden and Pence handed over immediately on request.
did ANY of those people try a coup?
Yes.
Remember when liberals took over parts of a city and created CHAZ/CHOP?
Oh no people in a park. Not at all the same as trying to overturn an election.
Also I remember when trumpets stormed the wa govs mansion.
People in a park?
Way to really under sell the destruction that happened there, but I guess that’s exactly what the democrats do.
They took over a large portion of a city, and people got shot. They wouldn’t let police in and let people die. They destroyed the buildings in there and innocent people had to leave who didn’t want to be involved.
There was deaths, arson and destruction
But sure. People in a park.
large portion? dude it was a park. and not even the whole park. ohh scary.
They took over a portion of the city. 6 city blocks.
Did you really gaslight yourself to believe it was just a park?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-53224445
This shows how large it was and how just people got shot
Some of ‘em did burn cars and buildings, I assume they would’ve fallen in line for storming Capitol Hill too.
Never underestimate those who will get violent because their preferred candidate didn’t win.
One side did and one side you’re just saying that the could have.
What’s the difference between those two?
On another note: What a username
👏 Golf Clap 👏
Never said there wasn’t a difference lol, nor would I.
But you did and now you’re straight up lying.
…uh, okay?
blame the left all you want it was trump and his supporters who attempted a coup.
…why the fuck would I blame ‘the left’ for Trump’s attempted coup?
Still no evidence Trump supported a coup
Also a coup that just followed the red velvet rope around? Yeah scary shit
And coming dangerously close to our elected officials while chanting they wanted to hang people with the gallows they built outside. And remember people died there. And there’s tons of evidence trump led it, why do you think he’s getting charged for it.
No one was in the building
An angry person smashing the window of a Starbucks is not a fucking threat to the Republic, dude.
People burning down cars very well could be, if some lunatic spent some time brainwashing ‘em.
“If. Could be.”
Didn’t happen though…
…again, I never said it did. Do you have poor reading comprehension?
If wishes were fishes I could feed the world, buddy. There’s a reason that left wing agitation is a threat to windows and right wing agitation is a threat to the Republic. It’s the difference between an insurrectionist traitor and an angry child.
Yes, that reason is that Republicans let a lunatic come into power, and he was able to consolidate his insane voterbase and stir ‘em up into a frenzy.
The small insignificant difference between the two is that those people didn’t try to break into congress and kill the people who disagreed
To be fair though, a few Dem supporters do scream quite a bit about how much they’d love to kill all conservatives. There were quite a few of those crazies demanding his head during the post-election drama too.
Not saying that Dem voters did actually do that, but I wouldn’t put it past some of ‘em either.
A few anti-Republican individuals (not necessarily even Democrats) saying some shit is nothing compared to leading members of the Republican party calling for violence. The shit they say is literally the position of the party itself.
Again, I did say there was a difference. Also, these were most certainly Democrats.
Can we call them neo-confederates already?
Pre Antebelum Republicans.
This doesn’t mean much when large swaths of them believe the earth is flat, the moon landing was faked, slavery helped black people, etc. Asking them their opinions on reality is like asking an amoeba how it feels about NFTs. The levels of insane & stupid coming from these people just means their thoughts & opinions are irrelevant.
They may be insane, but they’re insane AND active voters. They’re also heavily armed.
While their thoughts and opinions are irrelevant their votes are absolutely relevant. Their susceptibility to basic, low-effort manipulation can unfortunately affect us all.
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If they vote then their delusions are very much relevant.
The same people believe an imaginary being lives in the sky, that aliens are always visiting Earth, and that dinosaurs never existed.
Maybe we should start saying the dinosaurs were aliens…
So birds are aliens! Mind blown!!
It’s a variety of topics I find denial of reality to be increasing. Climate change science, including the history of how long ago people like Carl Sagan made it a widespread topic. Medical science with pandemics, nonsensical views on how vaccines work. Wild views about how windmills work and interact with the environment.
I was driving through rural Trump country not long ago and saw a billboard that had that iconic image of Man evolving from our ape-like ancestors. The billboard had a big red X through it and said No! God created!
That broke me. Literally broke me. Really helped me understand their response to covid and climate change et al. God help us when the next pandemic hits when permafrost in the arctic starts melting and releases all kind of microorganisms humans have never encountered before. Good luck fighting climate change when 40% of the country thinks evolution is a lie and god just went ‘click’.
Some people hate thinking god is not constantly thinking about them and that they aren’t super special
People must be kept stupid and afraid is seems. I don’t know why. Power and control probably, but this is disgusting. All you can do is look out for yourself.
A brain-dead population is way easier to control. Source: greetings from Hungary!
The Republicans actually went to Hungary to learn from Orban.
What? Can you provide an article so I can read more about this?
https://www.vice.com/en/article/88gzvb/cpac-hungary-orban
Matt Schlapp, the head of the American Conservative Union and organizer of its influential conference series CPAC, told NPR this week that he was bringing his event to Hungary because it “represents Christian conservative values” and American conservatives want to replicate this in the U.S. by learning from the country’s ultra-right-wing authoritarian prime minister, Viktor Orbán.
Jesus Christ, it’s like an educational field trip for fascism. Thank you for the article.
Sort of like the US Christian groups that went to Uganda and guided them until we now have a death penalty for being gay there
My neighbour denied that it was hot outside while he was outside in record heat
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No, but remember, those 70% will likely vote for the assbag, no matter how the legal matters fall out.
Another four year term from Trump would be absolutely disastrous. After being sworn in, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if, instead of making a speech, he simply took a copy of the Constitution and just tore it up.
I am terrified of that happening
Luckily the other 30% won’t vote for him again, meaning he’ll never win.
There might not be very many smart Republican voters, but there are just enough to ensure that Trump has no chance.
Everyone thinking he had no chance of winning is exactly how he won in 2016.
Oh please. Remember when Democrats went to the Sacramento Capitol armed? Or when Maxine Waters called for protestors to “get confrontational” and incited her own blend of “insurrection”?
Short memories with you lot. Willfully deceitful and always in bad faith.
Oh, plenty of interference I’m sure. He had help and admitted to it, just not directly.
Don’t worry I’m sure the next vote will also be fortified to get the result you want, that’s pure democracy right there
