I lost a friend to ket. He was partying with bad people, he was sick, choked on his vomit and they stole his stuff / left him to die.
Ketamine is a very interesting ride, and has wonderful potential as an antidepressant, but for the love of yourself (and my badly missed friend, John the magic man), PLEASE have someone compus mentus watching over you while you experience it, if you choose to do so.
Also strongly recommend you DO NOT mix with alcohol.
And always review information on erowid’s website before using any drug
Oh erowid…. Brings me back to college
Erowid is a brilliant resource!
Ketamine also should not be used in people with high blood pressure as it may further increase it and heart rates to dangerous levels.
Hot tubs increase heart rate as well however the blood pressure is lowered.
Oh yah, he had heart disease which is a no go with hot tubs.
Not to mention Buprenorphine on top of the ketamine which is bad news with a hot tub.
Meh, I’ve been on bupe for 4 years and love hot baths and such, it’s not that big of a deal. His previous issues were more of a problem than that. Buprenorphine is somewhat of a miracle drug for those of us who have been trying to battle opiate addiction. It has very very little side effects and does nothing more than stop the craving and make someone like myself feel like a normal person instead of like the fucking junkie that I am (was).
Not denying that it has depressive effects on respiratory and other systems. But if you’re not abusing other drugs while using it, there’s really not any problem with that.
I’m on bupe as well, but both together is a bad news with the hot water. It increases the chance to sleep, and falling asleep in a hot tub will make you drown.
Add to his known addictive personality that he has had a problem with for decades, he shouldn’t have been on that combination.
I personally hate bupe because it rarely works on my chronic pain I’ve had for the last 20 years. The media blew up the legal fentanyl patches I safely took almost 10 years ago that gave me a normal life. This will be just another excuse to restrict medication that works. A buddy of mine has stopped his suicidal issues because of ketamine therapy.
What about taking ketamine at the end of a 3 day meth binge to take the edge off the come down?
Sounds sensible
Benzos are a better choice, not sure why you’d want to end the fun after only three days though.
They gave me ketamine the last time I was in the hospital for pain so they could knock me out.
It was the single worst experience of my life, even worse than the injury I was being knocked out for. I was semi conscious the entire time, but I couldn’t feel or hear anything. I just knew people were all around me doing something. It feels like I was dead for a while. I have very few memories from the time they first gave it to me in the ambulance to the time I woke up at home the next day.
Fucking awful experience all around. Next time I was in the hospital for an unrelated condition I told them I’d rather have zero pain medicine than even a tiny amount of ketamine
Low dose ketamine is drastically different than the dosage used to sedate someone
They gave me low dose in the ambulance. While it was a decent high, I still had the same memory issues (which I always have while high, but at least I can normally remember something)
A recreational dose is far lower than what a medical professional would give you. The intentions are different.
Good to know, especially since the ambulance really didn’t give me much.
I’m still gonna pass on it though cause that was such an awful experience and I’d much rather just take an edible
I don’t understand why this is bad?
I’m reading this like you’re unhappy you don’t remember the pain? And you want pain?
Or is this sarcasm?
No, it’s basically an entire day of my life that I know happened but I can’t remember any specific details of. I know I went through insane amounts of physical and emotional trauma (I laid there in pain for no less than 8 hours because it was literally the same week COVID started), and not being able to remember it at all is preventing me from moving on or healing.
Idk if it’s just a me thing, but I hate not remembering entire large sections of time. After the first time I got black out drunk I didn’t drink alcohol for almost 2 years
Do you know why they gave you ketamine instead of something more standard like morphine?
Absolutely no idea. The other hospital I mentioned was confused as to why they did it as well.
Doesn’t surprise me at all!
The groups of ‘friends’ that do shit like ketamine are almost always scumbags just keeping each other down.
I think you and I had very different experiences! While ket abuse can defo lead to paranoia and becoming more insular, in my circles it was taken at hard house / trance events or after parties. Lots of silliness and fun times.
Unfortunately for my friend, he lived on his own in Manchester and fell in with a rough crowd after moving to Salford :'(
Matt Le Blanc:
"…I guess you’re keeping the 20 bucks you owe me.”
This is exactly the kind of humour Perry would’ve appreciated
And Elon Musk eats that stuff for breakfast and keeps truckin’ on. Life is unfair.
He is not just truckin’ along. The man looks like someone’s aunt is trying to build mass. He looks like an uncooked weisswurst got a planet fitness membership. He is a torso made manifest. Hair plugs and ozempic riding the right-wing-pipeline down a k-hole.
Hot tubs + drugs don’t mix. Even alcohol is dangerous because the effect of the hot tub increases the effects. We bought a hot tub recently and they’re are dozens of warnings about drugs/alcohol.
My recommendation to Elon would be to have a nice big dose and take a long dip.
This is no joke. I went into a hot tub with 1 beer once and when I got out, I got a blood pressure drop and almost fainted.
Exactly! It’s no joke
Does this work with weed?
No. Weed is safe.
Well I know it’s safe, but I was hoping I could get more high just for being in a hot tub
Just one of Elon’s talents, along with making drama
Takes note: Don’t do horse-tranquilizers alone in a bath, check. As a matter of fact don’t do any analgesic/anesthetic with additional drugs in a bath, also check.
Calling them horse tranquilizers is misleading. Ketamine was and still is used in medicine and is on the WHO list of essential medicines.
My cat is prescribed gabapentin. Some even get tramadol. Warfarin literally was rat poison until we got all but the craziest SOBs with an abundance of vitamin K in they’re veins.
Yeah, I feel like there is a war on K because it can absolutely replace opiates in pre-hospital pain management. Break a leg? Let the medics hit you with ketamine. Oh, your BP is a little low? No worries, ketamine doesn’t care.
It is better than an opiate with none of the contraindications. And I’m oversimplifying, but I can’t help but think some of this news coming out is almost a hit piece to dub ketamine dangerous, when it is, in fact, magnitudes safer than opiates.
oh, I tried that last month ! Pretty sweet high, relaxing. Like a really soft mdma (really soft!)
(I was talking about gabapentin, just realized it was ambiguous)
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I meant gabapentin, sorry for the confusion
It’s not misleading when it’s literally used as a horse tranquilizer.
If I say I’m serving cat food for dinner, and then whip out a nice piece of salmon sashimi, I wasn’t being misleading because cats eat fish? If so, you’re really killing some of my dad jokes here.
If you open a can of cat food and eat it, does it stop being cat food?
No. So please expand as I’m not sure what this question was meant to demonstrate.
It’s also used on infants for anesthesia due to how safe it is.
Maybe we should start calling it “baby tranquilizer” instead?
Oh hell yes.
Foal tranq.
Lol okay that was funny.
Every human medication is also used on animals.
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Horse tranquilizers?
When Friends was current I wasn’t a fan, the small bits I’d seen mostly annoyed me and - disaffected gothy teens/early twenties guy that I was - I dismissed it as one of those things everyone in the mainstream liked and was therefore obviously garbage.
Nowadays I’m married to a Friends fan who has begun showing me the series. As we progress through the box set I’m realizing it’s actually pretty good, a couple of the characters actually still annoy me when they’re focused on but there’s a ton else going on that’s pretty entertaining. I’m particularly surprised to be enjoying Chandler so much.
It’s very sad what Matthew Perry went through in life and how he died, but I’m now belatedly appreciating some of the work he did.
Look for “Friends without laugh track” clips on Youtube.
you can’t just do that mate, same with Seinfeld, they were filmed in front of a live audience, they had to stop for laughter otherwise you wouldn’t hear what they are saying.
or are you gonna come out and say Seinfeld isn’t hilarious?
I love those!
I’m still not sure I’d call it good, but it was a big step up from sitcoms before it. It tried pretty hard to not be sexist, and introduced some diversity that wasn’t just John Ritter pretending to be gay for lulz. It is still spectacularly unrealistic, but whatever. It’s a sitcom! It does have some genuinely funny moments.
I still periodically get “Smelly Cat” stuck in my head. Fuck, I’m guilty of making Ross-esque synthesizer music…
Very true. There are also definitely still some 1990s-era LGBTQIA+ phobic jokes which were wrong then and really stick out now, but in general I’d call the writing surprisingly decent.
As a New Yorker, though, I still couldn’t afford that apartment in a million years.
I still couldn’t afford that apartment in a million years.
Neither could they, it was rent controlled due to Monica’s grandmother living there, and they illegally kept her name on the lease for the cheap rent.
And Chandler made good money, so he could afford the smaller 2 bedroom.
that’s too much, man
Damn, I did not know Ket could depress respiration like this! In fact Ket is used medicinally in place of opioids as it doesn’t depress respiration. But here is the TIL part: it should not be mixed with benzos or alcohol (or other depressants I would imagine). I don’t use bu I hope someone who does get to read this.
ketamine is anaesthetic and was used in the past in combat medicine and such, because it is quite safe when administered by untrained staff. the fact it is used to treat depression is new to me, but getting in the pool while high on it is the most stupid idea ever :(.
He was in the bathtub and drowned. If you take enough ketamine, it will literally incapacitate you (for many, that’s the entire point). He did this in a bathtub.
He did not die from overdosing on ketamine, because that’s nearly impossible. He was stupid and incapacitated himself in a bathtub and drowned. It sucks, and it’s easy to just blame a chemical.
I’m sure there are people who die after having a couple drinks and getting into the tub, but do we then say that they “died due to the acute effects of alcohol”? No. We say they drowned.
I
Lost in the K-hole.
As someone who enjoys the near death experience of being a flattened disk of light energy folding in space time, this makes me sad.
Don’t worry. Consciousness is immortal so you’ll be able to live as much time as you want as a disc of light or whatever.
So I wouldn’t actually want to be stuck in it forever. It’s hard to explain but my k-holes are quite dark and dreadful, it’s what I explained in my previous comment except looping. I don’t have a physical body anymore and I’m just a thought process floating through space in a stream of color. There’s this creeking noise like a door opening that starts off real low pitch and slowly speeds up to the point it’s high pich and extremely fast. Then it’s like hitting a wall and you fly in to a million pieces an slowly gather yourself in that state and then it repeats.
It feels like that is what you have been since the beginning of time. It feels like a near death experience and when i come out some kind of reverse psychology goes on in my brain. I just think about how much it would suck if that was real. My depression goes away for quite awhile afterwards.
Whenever I do nitrous, I see this same truth. The truth is that the universe has four phases. Being high on nitrous and seeing the structure is one of the four states.
There’s some kind of four-phase clockwork thing chugging along. Normal existence I think is one of the states?
I can’t remember. All I can remember is being astounded, every time, that I’m back in the “aware of what’s going on phase”, and I struggle mightily to remember the lesson, knowing I won’t be able to because the next phase is defined by my ignorance of it.
It’s maddening.
I’d love to do some serious ketamine sometime. I did a little line at a party once in 2006 and that was for my ketamine experience. It was a tiny bump and didn’t really affect me much. Nothing even remotely psychedelic, that I recall.
At that same party I did a huge hit of fucking homemade habanero extract (on purpose) and that was way more mind-blowing.
K and nitrous… that’s mothers love.
Unfortunately it doesn’t matter if you want to or not. You are literally never going to die.
You can die in other people’s worlds, but not in your own. Other people will die in your universe, but your own life will, beyond all odds, only continue forever.
You’ll die in others’ universes of course. Other people will lose you. But you’ll never lose yourself.
No choice, pal.
But I don’t think you’ll be human the whole time. Human lifespan is a century or so. So the story of your life will have to change to account for your survival. Eventually, no human story will suffice any longer. In these other timelines where you survive, you may be uploaded into a machine, or possibly disconnect from your body via astral projection, or wake up in a simulated universe instead, with different laws around death.
But at some point during the eternity, you’ll probably be the disc of light. I’m guessing trillions of years out, after the heat death of the universe has rendered it incapable of supporting any kind of life as we know it.
This is something I recently learned, actually. That we’re immortal.
Please do go submit this information to an academic journal and accept your Nobel.
No way to prove it yet
My awareness going on forever sounds hellish. I don’t want to only live 70-100 years, but I also wouldn’t want to live 1000 years, let alone billions.
So I sure hope you’re wrong on that front (and I think you are). The universe is a cruel enough place as it is.
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My man.
I’ve been there too. I saw the singularity and touched god… and I’m a goddamn atheist. Coming back from that experience changed me. The memories were fleeting. I couldn’t remember the specifics after I returned to baseline. All the knowledge that I was given dissipated… but the overwhelming sense of calm persisted.
If I’m gonna die, it’d be a good way to go out.
My biggest k-hole was my most terrifying and incredible experience I’ve ever had. I haven’t done it since. I will again someday.
The curtain of consciousness was peeled back and I saw what was beyond life and time and brain. It was neat, it horrified me.
In the K-hole licking balloon knot.
Ketamine’s effects on respiratory shit is serious.
I almost stopped breathing during an assisted experience because I didn’t realize mixing K with benzos was dangerous.
It’s how Elijah McClain died too. Young kid stopped by police for matching the description. They shot him full of ketamine and he died of respiratory failure.
Can’t recall all the details, but the impression I got was his respiratory failure was caused by the officer choking him with a knee on his windpipe. EMTs did give a very high dose of ketamine at 5mg/kg body weight, whereas I usually use 0.5-1mg/kg body weight to put patients under surgical anesthesia.
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was it Ks resp effects or the combination with another downer that was serious
and therefore not Ks fault and solely youre fault for not researching the chem
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Im fairly certain that what I’m about to say will be disliked by ketamine users and abstainers.
Ketamine is garbage at everything besides temporarily lobotomizing people. It works for it’s many uses because it makes the user stupid. It’s often given to suicidal people, not because it’s a miracle drug, but because it incapacitates them in a safe manner.
That said, it’s great at making people too stupid to be able to hurt themselves, most of the time. It’s great at numbing psychological pain because the user will be too stupid to conceptualize their own thoughts or realize where they are physically.
It’s also hard on the urinary system and has a fleeting high.
If you like ketamine then by all means, you do you. If you may be interested in trying ketamine, become a zombie safely, just don’t expect it to cure your depression, woes, or any of your other problems.
Yeah, I’m gonna take the peer reviewed studies results that show that ketamine is quite effective with relieving drug resistant depression over this post of yours…
https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2023/10/ketamine.html
Yeah but I don’t like when peoole see one study and then claim that it’s conclusive. The consensus is that there may there might be something to it being useful for depression, and it should be studied further. No high confidence.
It is useful in creating a sense of disassociation of self - the same thing that meditation does. It even affects the same regions of the brain as meditation. When used carefully, with therapeutic intent, it can be an effective treatment for depression.
Recreational use is sketchy, definitely. But the science is there for using it therapeutically.
But your assessment of its efficacy is not contradictory to DontHavePants observation. They didn’t say it wasn’t effective.
I have no dog in this fight, but any studies done on brain chemistry and psychological effects need to be taken with a grain of salt. We know so little about the brain and consciousness that most of the stuff we’re trying and doing are educated guesses.
And random social media text posts need to be taken with a cargo ship’s load worth of salt.
Nothing I said is in any contention with ketamine/depression studies.
Ketamine is garbage at everything besides temporarily lobotomizing people. It works for it’s many uses because it makes the user stupid. It’s often given to suicidal people, not because it’s a miracle drug, but because it incapacitates them in a safe manner.
This quote from you contradicts what you’ve just said.
Or, get this, everyone experiences drugs differently and your bad anecdote is irrelevant next to the mountains of evidence and peer reviewed studies.
Once again, I haven’t disputed or attempted to refute any of these “mountains of evidence.”
I judge my desire to try drugs by how people act when they’re on them. Do they look like they’re having fun at least? Two drugs I’ve never had an interest in:
Ketamine
Nitrous
That’s unfortunate. The effects of many drugs can be entirely mental rather than visual, leaving the person looking like they’re just laying down with their eyes closed, or staring into space.
Particularly, ketamine, as a dissociative, at higher doses, is entirely in your mind. What a person in that state looks like from the outside is zero indication of what they are experiencing.
It’s not unfortunate. To me drugs are entirely unnecessary to begin with. And if I choose to use them it’s to enhance an activity, not to replace an activity or be an activity on its own. I’ll be fine.
To each their own for sure, but that right there is a combination for some very strange times. Sometimes fun is becoming part of the couch and traveling into outer space. They’re definitely not all get up and dance and have fun, though.
Nitrous is great
Alcohol.
people definitely look like they are having fun drinking
Can confirm that alcohol is fun for as long as you can stand up straight
drinking alone is shite though.
I’ve just had some pretty good nights in just me, a bottle of wine, and a movie
Same here. I had some good nights drinking and gaming. Still doesn’t beat toking or eating edibles and gaming though but I’ve been abstaining for over a year lol
fair enough. for.me.oersonally it started getting out of hand in the pandemic. so I try to keep it social and be a good boy on school nights.
I guess in the commercials. But we don’t actually see them drinking.
I had a lot of fun on the booze last night. my mouth is full of regret and bile today however.
I would add to this that anyone doing ketamine should not do it in the bath, which seems to be what happened here. The same happened to someone I knew, she drowned in the tub.
Any drug close water where you can drown is a recipe for disaster. Someone I knew pop an acid tab at the beach and drown itself.
Yeah, “don’t k-hole in the bathtub” seems like pretty good (and hopefully obvious) advice. This seems more like user error than the acute effects of the drug itself.
He didn’t die from overdosing on ketamine, because that’s nearly impossible.
He drowned.
Agreed. Don’t get lobotomized in any body of water.
To expand on the urinary issues ketamine causes, the problem is that ketamine will recrystallize inside your blatter and ketamine crystals can be pretty sharp.
Ketamine is definitely up there with ‘hip’ drugs not worth trying.
Along with MDMA and Xanax.
I don’t really respect anyone who does these because they’re usually living a lifestyle that leads to nowhere.
MDMA not worth it? It’s euphoria and love in a pill, not addictive, and quite safe when you do not abuse it. Millions of people use it and have been using it for about half a century and the vast majority of it restricts it to when they’re partying with few side effects. I think you misjudge its use a bit.
Yes it can be acutely abused because you’re chasing the dragon on nights that you do use it, but that is also a result of its illegal nature and a lack of education.
Of the chemical variants of drugs, I’d say it’s probably one of the few that is actually worth it, besides LSD.
Yeah, I try to tell people that there’s value in MDMA beyond just a night out dancing. My favorite times have been on a couch with friends, getting deep into one another and kind of exploring your minds. I’ve had some incredibly important and memorable conversations with people that I was able to become very close with because MDMA let us drop the walls and talk about things, which is something I cannot do face to face with someone sober. And I’m not an introvert by any stretch, I have no problem being the center of a conversation, I have no problem listening to others, but opening up about personal issues was something MDMA let me do, and say things I never could put into words.
I’ve also stood in front of a wall of speakers and had bright lights and bass music thrown at me, and that’s also fun.
You’d be shocked by how many very successful and incredibly intelligent people have used drugs (including MDMA). Many still use them regularly. MDMA, in the right setting and in moderation, can (will) be a life-affirming and beautiful experience.
This honestly sounds like something a child would say after having D.A.R.E. in elementary school.
Do you know any of them personally?
I know people like this. Though I should probably define regularly as once every few weeks for k. Probably closer to like 2 to 4 times a year for MDMA. Obviously if you’re doing stuff every day then you won’t be productive in a job
You literally just replied to one, my guy.
And yes, I know plenty of people like that. And chances are, so do you. You just don’t know it.
Edit; in case you’re young, I don’t want anyone to take this as evidence that “drugs are ok”, or “they lied to us about cannabis/MDMA, so that means they lied about heroin too.” No. This is why we’d be much better off if they were just honest from the beginning. Not all drugs are created equal, but also the classification system in the US (and most modern nations) is not necessarily based on potential harm.
So to be clear, my comment is not necessarily true for all drugs, I am specifically referring to MDMA right now (which, before becoming illegal, was used by doctors to great effect as an aid in couples’ therapy).
Hmmm, I don’t know the second one but mdma is great fun. Of course you have to be in a good state of mind before trying, but it’s a potent empathogen that has its uses.
One of the most fun nights of my life is when I went to visit a friend at his university, we took some and he immediately ended up with some girl and disappeared on me.
So I decided that I would just wander his campus looking for parties. I took shots with frat boys, danced with some gays guy out dressed in drag, played chess with some guy on the quad (he would have destroyed me even if I was sober), found another friend and went and partied with her and her lesbian friends (“wait you’re a lesbian now?” “Maybe not sure”) and then made the biggest mistake of my life when I turned down joining them when I was making a hasty exit after I noticed one of the girls was eating the other out right next to me on the couch.
wild 😁 Yea I get how you’d want a do over heheh
My experience is very vanilla coming after yours, but we had some of that and spent the entire night in my last floor apartment just chatting and drinking looking at the sea. It was full moon too. At one point I must have thought it was around midnight, I peeked at the east-facing window in my room and a big ball of fire was burning on the horizon. Time really flew this night…
No shit. In other news Epstein didn’t hang himself.
I didn’t even think it was possible to die from ket. Although doing lots of ket in the water sounds like a planned suicide
You can die drinking too much water too fast, most drugs can easily kill you.
I was looking up psilocybin and was surprised to see the mean fatal dose for a bunch of lab animals. Didn’t bother equating it to humans, but I was surprised.
Jesus christ, scientists. Tripping a lab rat to death? fuck
Maybe they attained enlightenment and left their bodies behind.
Eventually, yeah. Enlightenment is the inevitable result of a trip to hell.
Erm, it’s really truly not that dangerous.
Let’s start with this chart (colorful chart near the top). The yellow-green bar on the right is cubensis, the most common shroom. 0.6% by weight. A typical dose of shrooms is gonna run about 0.5g to 2g, meaning a typical shrooms trip hits you with up to 12mg psilocybin. A shroom is roughly half a gram, maybe a whole gram, let’s just use 1g shrooms for simplicity–6mg of drug mass in that shroom.
LD50 for psilocybin is 280mg/kg. This is how LD50 is always measured–amount of drug (in mass units) per kg of body weight, in order to reach a 50% likelihood of fatal symptoms resulting in death.
Now, the average adult weight is somewhere in the 50-100kg range. Let’s take someone on the lighter end at 50kg. How many shrooms would our dainty psychonaut have to take to have a chance of dying? The math is simple: 280 * 50 / 6 gives us (LD50 * shroom count) for a grand total of: 233 largish shrooms, taken rapidly, to have a chance of dying from it. Now, you could refine it and pack that much of the drug into a much smaller dose than 233 shrooms, but we’re getting into silliness at this point.
Basically, don’t take hundreds of shrooms at once and you’ll be aight.
The math is simple: 280 * 50 / 6 gives us (LD50 * shroom count) for a grand total of: 233 largish shrooms, taken rapidly, to have a chance of dying from it
You mean to get to the point where you have a 50% chance if dying from it. You still have a chance (<50%) of doing from it at much lower doses.
it is actually really hard for ketamine to kill you, that is why it was used as anaesthetic in combat medicine, because it is safe to be administered by untrained staff. but it is really important not to anaesthetize yourself in the pool :(.
I’ve never done ketamine but going into a K-hole in a hot tub sounds incredibly dangerous. I don’t know what’s more sad if it was planned or not.
If another comment was to be believed, he had heart disease. Ketamine plus a hot tub, probably alcohol (? Someone correct me if I’m wrong please) my chest hurts just from thinking about that. His heart probably damn near ruptured
No alcohol. I read the coroner’s report.
Anything that has the effect of Ketamine would easily kill in the right amount, let alone in a pool of water. If they use it as animal anesthesia its probably pretty potent. Can be fun in the right amounts but got to be safe and careful.
Does that mean he died of OD?
Perry had been undergoing ketamine infusion therapy prior to his death, reportedly for depression and anxiety. The toxicology report adds: “At the high levels of ketamine found in his postmortem blood specimens, the main lethal effects would be from both cardiovascular overstimulation and respiratory depression.”
He was getting it as treatment, but technically yes
He was definately taking it recreationally too, a therapeudic dose wouldn’t even be close to enough to OD on. Long term ketamine use can have it’s own risks if the dose isn’t kept very low.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuPNmXtomNw
Do your thing piped bot. I tried to link this from newpipe but whatever
