“Yes don’t vote at all to get rid of fascism”
There’s two sides to this argument, and one is wrong and the other is right.
One says “Both sides do it, so it’s okay that my side does it.”
The other says “Your side does it. A few on my side do it, too. But it doesn’t matter, we should stop both sides from doing it.”
“It happens on both sides! you don’t condemn it on your side, isnt that hypocritical?!”
“I… Actually condemn everyone doing it and I think me and you should look for and support people who don’t support this heinous thing.”
“…”
“So, do you condemn the people on your side doing it as wel-”
“But look at this person who has done it on your side!”
Both sides’d themselves into proto-fascism. And taking us along for the ride.
Fucking morons.
Why are you blaming leftists for Trumps win? We make up like 1% of the population, tops. You should instead point the finger at Republicans for voting for him. Or the Dems for running a totally weak and ineffectual campaign. (Or how about the oligarchs who only want to divide us so that they can rob us blind?)
Absolutely. Trump only goes more insane. At least with Kamala we would have had a chance to push left policies, and they wouldn’t be going directly to fucking fascism, unlike t-Rump.
I always just post this article.
Literally the first fucking sentence.
Vice President and Democratic presidential candidate Kamala Harris said Washington will continue to pressure Israel and other players in the Middle East to reach a ceasefire deal in Gaza
She said she’d continue pressure that wasn’t happening? Wow, what a fucking saint.
Former Israeli ambassador, Michael Herzog, made a startling admission about Biden’s support: “God did the State of Israel a favour that Biden was the president during this period. We fought [in Gaza] for over a year and the administration never came to us and said, ‘ceasefire now.’ It never did. And that’s not to be taken for granted.”
Biden never pressured Israel for ceasefire, as Israeli officials boast of exploiting US support
For the first four months of the Gaza war, the Biden administration opposed a full ceasefire, instead opting at best for a temporary “pause” to facilitate the delivery of humanitarian aid, which was briefly achieved in late November 2023. Biden said earlier that month: “a cease-fire is not peace… every cease-fire is time [Hamas members] exploit to rebuild their stockpile of rockets, reposition fighters and restart the killing.”
A senior member of Israel’s negotiating team said in April that “Since January, it’s clear to everyone that we’re not conducting negotiations. It happens again and again: You get a mandate during the day, then the prime minister makes phone calls at night, instructs ‘don’t say that’ and ‘I’m not approving this,’ thus bypassing both the team leaders and the war cabinet.”
Throughout this period, Biden refrained completely from publicly calling out Netanyahu for explicitly sabotaging the talks.
On May 5, Hamas accepted the April proposal with reservations and amendments, but before the Israeli negotiating team got to formulate a response, Israel’s prime minister rushed to denounce Hamas’ position as “delusional” and ordered the immediate invasion of Rafah on May 7.
Biden, who had promised to halt arm supplies to Israel if it violated his “red line” of invading Rafah, decided to instead suspend one shipment of MK-84 2,000-pound bombs to Israel and nothing more.
After lengthy negotiations, on July 2 Hamas accepted an updated Biden proposal with minor amendments, particularly relating to assurances that the ceasefire would lead to ending the war instead of a mere pause, according to multiple senior Arab and Palestinian officials involved in the talks. Hamas were informed that the US and Israeli negotiating team were both on board. However, a few days later, Netanyahu issued four new “non-negotiable” conditions that mediators and even Israeli security officials saw as intentionally sabotaging the deal. The conditions were: resuming the war after a pause “until [Israel’s] war aims are achieved”; no IDF withdrawal from the Philadelphia corridor between Rafah and Egypt; Israel would restrict the return of over one million displaced Gazans to the Northern half of the enclave; maximizing the number of living hostages to be released in the first phase.
In August, ahead of the Democratic National Convention, the US opened a renewed round of negotiations, having received Iranian and Hezbollah promises of refraining from retaliation if a deal was reached.
Instead of building upon Biden’s proposal and pressing Israel to compromise, the Americans simply incorporated Netanyahu’s four impossible conditions as “a bridging proposal.” They attempted to entice Hamas to the table by getting Israel to reduce its veto on which Palestinian detainees it would release in a deal (Hamas presented a list of 300 heavily sentenced individuals, “the VIPs.” Netanyahu vetoed 100 names, including Marwan Barghouti, and insisted on only releasing prisoners with less than 22 years left in their sentence. The Americans lowered this veto to 75 names then 65 in August, per a senior Arab mediator).
As soon as the DNC ended, Biden blamed Hamas again for the failure of the talks, and effectively stopped trying to get a deal, with US officials declaring in September that a ceasefire deal has become unlikely during Biden’s term. Since then, the White House has attempted to re-write history and promote an official narrative blaming Hamas for Netanyahu’s systematic foiling of the talks.
The Biden Administration’s False History of Ceasefire Negotiations
Sorry to make you read more than the first sentence of an article. In fact I suggest you read the whole thing, since I picked out these quotes pretty arbitrarily. I know you won’t though, because you probably think you’re immune to propaganda so long as you only read the “right” news that just happens to be entirely in agreement with both you and the status quo that has allowed a genocide to happen before our eyes.
Thanks, tankie. Trump appreciates your non vote.
Maybe there would be more than Side A and Side B if we had voting reform and Democrats didn’t systematically sue third-parties off the ballot.
People (not just authoritarians) criticize Side A because they have way more tallies than most have been led to believe. Everybody who pays any amount of attention knows that Side B has a lot of tallies. What good comes out of specifically pointing out the tallies of Side B when literally everybody on non-conservative social media is blasted with the knowledge of those tallies? If you want somebody to preach to the choir or inform you about Side B’s tallies, just ask. If you think people paying attention to or being informed about Side A’s tallies is dangerous and harmful, just say so.
Side A tolerates third-world exploitation (labor, resources, goods) that the US economy still relies on, they tolerate the US economy still relying on slavery and child slavery, they tolerate or support US imperialism and regime change, they refuse to address or come up with solutions for the fresh water crisis (by 2030, demand will exceed supply by 40%), they refuse to properly address many issues that the US people face (the economy, the housing crisis, the health care crisis, etc.), they support harmful policies like fracking, they have allowed corporations/et. al to go out of control under their power, and they generally have not advocated for strong regulation and protections for the American people. Yes, Side B is undesirable, but Side A is insufficient.
If Side A’s hands are always tied in a two-party system, then they should impeach the bad actor, push voting/election reform and term limits, and hold fair and democratic primaries and elections. Side A not propping up extreme right-wing candidates (like Trump) and telling the media to take them seriously would be nice, too.
1/3 of Americans don’t vote and plenty of people only voted Kamala because they didn’t want Trump (and there are other factors than Gaza, misogyny, and Jill Stein voters at play to explain why people didn’t come out to vote for her). Plenty of people probably don’t want Trump (or anybody like him) if they’ve been paying any attention and didn’t fall for the propaganda.
Side A would get bonus points for not alienating progressives, for supporting the loosening of requirements for ballot access (and stop engaging in lawfare to restrict ballot access), and for supporting fair and inclusive debates on public property where they would have to address perspectives and topics that are potentially uncomfortable or inconvenient for them.
I realize there are plenty of unserious actors who run for president (like Kayne West) who would try their best to poison open debates and abuse expanded ballot access, but there has to be some fair mechanism to filter (openly racist and insane) people like him out. Perhaps a competency test of sorts with independent observation would be appropriate.
And I realize a lot of people find Jill Stein to be harmful (and individuals like her), but maybe we shouldn’t arrest her (or any other presidential candidate) and put her in a black site, shackling her to a chair for 8 hours, because she wanted to be present at the presidential debate?
This is an unprecedented time for the American people, with human rights and due process in jeopardy. We are facing multiple serious crises with no solutions or progress in sight - voting and election reform, in addition to term limits, are all urgent and necessary.
I don’t care if you want to vote for Side A no matter what — we can only suppress criticism and stay in denial of major issues for so long before (e.g.) the fresh water crisis hits us and humanity is completely and utterly unprepared.
I appreciate the depth of your response. You’re right, critiquing Side A doesn’t mean endorsing Side B. It means demanding better from those who claim to represent us. The meme calls out false equivalency, but that shouldn’t silence legitimate concerns about the system itself.
It’s like this: if the house is on fire, I’ll vote to put out the biggest flame, but I’m also going to ask why the fire keeps spreading, and who’s refusing to fix the wiring. Reform isn’t a distraction; it’s how we stop the next blaze before it starts.
Thanks for adding a more nuanced layer to the conversation.
Republicans also use 3rd party as a spoiler and to siphon off D voters too.
Whether they use them intentionally or not, we need voting reform. In the 2024 election, third-parties barely made a dent — they weren’t a spoiler.
FPTP is exactly why third-parties can be a “spoiler”. There are plenty of valid alternative voting systems to explore that are way more fair and democratic.
And it doesn’t sound very democratic of the Democratic Party to repeatedly and systematically restrict ballot access through lawsuits. Ballot access is hard enough for third-parties to achieve in most states.
its well known Republicans have funded 3rd parties to do this, not all of them but enough that its suspicious. its not all of them.
There were a bunch of stories of Republicans helping Cornel West’s campaign last year to act as a spoiler.
There’s also the fact that both sides support capitalism, which is an evil ideology that has killed more people than communism ever did. Like for real, capitalism kills 10 million people every year just through starvation and withholding lifesaving medication. That means that every decade capitalism kills more than even the highest estimates of communism’s total headcount over the last 100 years (which, btw, those estimates include Nazis killed in WW2).
Hey cockhead, look up the fucking holodomor, and don’t just read the denialist BS.
Or the Katyn Massacre.
Or the Blagoveshchensk Massacre.
Or the Kyiv Massacre.
Or the Amur River Massacre.
I can go on, if you’d like?Ok great, you can name a bunch of the events that make up the alleged 100 million deaths caused by communists. That doesn’t take away from the fact that capitalist governments have FAR more blood on their hands.
And we can debate back and forth on the historicity of the events you named, but you should at least know that the Holodomor was literally coined by a self-proclaimed fascist to try and conflate Nazi crimes with Soviet errors.
“both sides”= a disengenious comment by conservative mainly also uses the same thing to say thier not as bad.
“Both sides” also used by liberals to tell you it doesn’t matter they voted for genocide because trump will do the same
both sides is primarly used by conservatives, 100% of the time, lol. its pretty obvious even on reddit. thier talking points often are right wing in nature and pretty disengeniously disguised. i have never seen a “liberal” if there is anything left of center right in america, say that at all.
Funny words coming from the fake “progressive” that claimed boths sides and sat at home or threw away a vote.
Does third party count then? One bar is a bar
“Perfect is, in fact, the enemy of good, and if we can’t have perfect then we shouldn’t settle for good!”
I do so wish their fucking around would limit the finding out to just them, but alas.
No, flipflops don’t work at all. My uncle’s neighbors former roommate only has 1 toe, so they solve nothing.
Am I correctly interpreting this to mean you think tankies threw the US presidential election? If so, do you have evidence that this is the case?
your bait is rotten and stinks, you know how to read. “Interpreting” = strawmanning/otherwise putting words in my mouth. Do I think they contributed? Absolutely. Dipshits are everywhere and many of them happen to reside here, and I read many comments from the usual tankie trolls doing nothing but shit-talk Harris as often as they could on Lemmy in the leadup to the election, which probably influenced a nonzero number of peoples opinions (again, dipshits everywhere). Does that in any way imply I think they’re solely responsible?
please take your chum elsewhere, thank you. I hear 4chan is back up these days, now you run along.
Friend, I’m sorry you read my comment as being an attack or an attempt to lure you out. It’s miscommunications like this that make me want to clarify things, which is why I asked instead of assuming. Another misunderstanding: By “throwing the election”, I didn’t mean being solely responsible for the electoral loss. What I mean by that is if you removed the tankie factor from the election, it could have gone the other way. Elections are won and lost on very fine margins. There may be 100 other things that had a similar impact which you could also say threw the election; none of them are solely responsible for it.
If you aren’t saying that they influenced the election to a degree that might have flipped it, then what is it we are “finding out” from their “fucking around”? And, do you consider having read many comments on lemmy as sufficient evidence to think that might be the case?
I don’t think that is what OP is referring to. I interpreted it as the strange measuring stick tankies use to compare the democrats and the republicans. Even accelerationists agree that the Republicans are way worse than the democrats.
100%, republicans are way worse than democrats. To be clear I’m not an accelerationist, I find it repugnant.
Prior to the second election of trump. I would wholeheartedly agree with you.
But as time goes on, it’s looking like we don’t have a democracy but a fascist dictatorship or oligarchy. In which case accelerationism may actually be the lesser evil.
Even if OP isn’t advocating thta, I am.
Tankues hve advocated to not vote democrat over gaza and less people voted for hillary than for biden.
Of course there’s no way proving this is true (and it shouldn’t, since voting should be nonymous) and it certainly was until a certain part also racism and sexism, but the intensity of the calls to boycott dems and Harris having way less votes than Biden is suspicious.
the intensity of the calls to boycott dems and Harris having way less votes than Biden is suspicious
There’s nothing suspicious about it. Voters have spent the last eight years watching their bills for food, health care, child care, and everything else spiral out of control without any meaningful help from Republicans or Democrats.
These millions opted not to miss work to vote because they know definitively that the two choices they had wouldn’t do anything to change how hard their lives have become.
It’s that simple.
Why would you have to miss work to vote?
Because elections occur on a weekday.
Do people only work every hour of a weekday in America? Plus don’t they have a system for voting ahead of time via post too, which you could sort out on a weekend leading up as well?
Do people only work every hour of a weekday in America?
Many do, yes. The majority of our population is so vastly underpaid that they work upwards of 100 hours a week at multiple jobs. (Which, as you can imagine, might inspire them to see a sort of futility in voting to begin with.) Also elections can entail hours-long waiting in line.
Plus don’t they have a system for voting ahead of time via post too
It depends on your state and local jurisdiction. Your right to vote by mail (or to vote conveniently) depends on where you live.
Ugh. Such a tired, stupid argument.
It doesn’t matter whether tankies actually threw the election to Trump.
THEY DIDN’T KNOW WHETHER THEIR ACTIONS WOULD CAUSE THAT TO HAPPEN WHEN THEY CHOSE TO DO SO.
People who refuse to vote when there is a clearly superior option deserve whatever the greater evil brings forth when they win.
Even when there isn’t a clearly superior option; there’s no excuse to not vote in the U. S. when the right to vote is such a pivotable portion of your history. We are barely over a half century away; only a mere 60 years. Unconscionable.
If voting is a right, then surely not voting is also a right. You seem to be confusing it with the word “responsibility.”
Considering I never said that one doesn’t have the right to not vote, I don’t believe I am; but you are correct that I consider it a responsibility.
On the one hand, corporatist party, on the other, literal fascists. Yes, clearly there is no superior option.
You seem to be deriving meaning unstated in my comment.
Then maybe vote for a third party.
A vote for a third party in presidential is not a vote.
It is a vote, and over 1.5 million Americans (excluding those for RFK) made such votes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_States_presidential_election#Results
IMO, progressives (who’s not too bothered by Stein’s cozying up to Russia a bit) from California, most of New England, DC, Maryland, Hawaii, or Washington (state), and yet yammer on about how bad third parties are because they split the Democrat vote, are probably stupid, or at least ignorant, and should give some of the time they spend watching CNN or Vaush to reading election stats.
how bad third parties are because they split the Democrat vote, are probably stupid, or at least ignorant, and should give some of the time they spend watching CNN or Vaush to reading election stats.
Hey, I don’t need to comment because you said it all for me.
Election stats? You ever hear the phrase “There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics”
Stats on their own given a poor analysis of an average joe/jane can mislead just as much if not more than a talking head can.
The core fact remains that voting for a third party under a first past the post system is risking permitting the greater evil to win.
Yes, I think it’s from Twain.
I backed my assertions with stats, however poor you think they are as analysis.
What do yo back up your assertions with, other than lame DNC, CNN, and Vaush talking points?
I simply cannot grasp why some people believe voting 3rd party in a presidential election isn’t one of the dumbest possible things you can do in life.
Like, beyond the fact that the 3rd party candidate with the most votes in 2024 got a whopping HALF OF A SINGLE PERCENT of the total votes cast, meaning a 3rd party literally cannot win, there’s still the reality that even if they did win, no 3rd party has A SINGLE MEMBER IN CONGRESS, so if a 3rd party presidential candidate actually won, they wouldn’t be able to do shit, because they’d have literally ZERO allies in Congress.
I’m pretty sure anyone voting 3rd party for president has absolutely no clue how our government works. They have no concept of the reality they live in.
I simply cannot grasp why some people believe voting 3rd party in a presidential election isn’t one of the dumbest possible things you can do in life.
You might want to say that to Michiganders who voted for Stein (and Oliver) because of Gaza and the US presence in the Middle East.
The 2024 Presidential election isn’t the only one in US history: there have been 57 others.
Trump had few allies in Congress before 2016, but now members are the Republican caucus are falling all over themselves to curry favour from him.
I’m pretty sure anyone voting 3rd party for president has absolutely no clue how our government works. They have no concept of the reality they live in.
You are so correct—as members of the herd generally are. I like people who resort to exaggerations, over generalizations, and distortions.
Non-voters are beneath Trump supporters in my opinion. They’re the lowest of the low. A complete failure to understand their civic duty that a ton of people died to allow them to have. At least Trump supporters get involved. In the worst, dumbest possible way, but involved nonetheless.
Aka “have the day you voted for”.
People who voted for the lesser evil is still voting for evil
“I would proudly vote for Hitler if slightly to the right of Hitler was on the ballot”. Good fucking job, you’re voting for Hitler. If you vote for Hitler you also deserve slightly to the right of Hitler.
Exactly
Lol. You sweet summer child.
And not voting is the greatest evil.
Given that you can act (in this case vote), your hands are more dirty permitting the worse evil to win through inaction.
You don’t get to clean your hands of things when you have the power to act to effect the outcome.
So saying “People voted for evil” is a selective self-benefiting myopia. Vote abstainers are not virtuous, they are a narcissists.
And people who didn’t vote for the lesser evil could have helped avoid the greater evil, but chose not to.
Wait I’m lost, are we talking foreign invasions done by the US vs foreign invasions done by China? Or the number of victims of Hamas vs the victims of the IDF? What are we counting here? Military bases abroad?
What are we counting here?
Evil policies supported by democrats vs evil policies supported by republicans
what evil polices do dems support that the republicans don’t?
There have been many at various times, and it also depends on your values, obviously. It also depends on whether you’re looking at things in specific times as opposed to generally.
There have been many times when many mainstream Democrats were pro-censorship but most Republicans were not.
Then there are other situations that I think are edge cases and therefore interesting. For example, Obamacare did make life better for real numbers of Americans, but it also guaranteed that we wouldn’t be looking at universal healthcare for a few more decades, if ever. And that was a law pushed for and passed by Democrats. Of course you could argue that it’s better than nothing, maybe it was, but medical debt is far worse now than it ever has been, and predictably so. So then you wonder why Democrats pushed for it, and we all know the answer to that, corruption. Of course they would say that it’s the best they could do, but is that even true? We’ll never find out, cuz they didn’t try.
So how do you rate rate these gray area situations? Things that are better than nothing but worse than a lot, but the politicians are only voting for them because they are corrupt.
So can you name a few?
Policies can be checked on both sides
Sure, but on average when some self proclaimed leftist’s opening is “Democrats did a bad thing” in a vacuum my immediate assumption is they’re a campist/tankie, accelerationist, or a rightwing psyop and my instinct is to immediately challenge them (most of the time… sometimes its me critiquing the dems)
Sometimes it turns out they’re giving an earnest critique but usually not.
What in the word salad are you talking about.
Leftists say funding Israel’s war crimes is bad. Check mark in both columns.
That’s not a critique of democrats, that’s a critique of a portion of democrats and all of republicans.
It’s a critique of the democrats that were in the running for president
Who made you the arbiter of another person’s earnestness? Can you read minds? And if you’re the one criticizing the Dems, does someone else take over?
I’m the arbiter of who I trust is arguing coherently or in good faith and I am ultimately not trusting of the average internet poster by default.
I’ve been arguing on dedicated internet debate spaces for a very very large portion of my life and I have a good eye for when someone isn’t worth being taken seriously.
I’ll take your word for it.
Drone strike deaths under Obama vs under Trump?
Talking about how some people deny or justify the horrendous things done by Lenin, Stalin, Mao, the Kim Dynastie, Malenkov, Khrushchev, Brezhnev, Ulbricht, Honecker, Guevara, Ho Chi Min, and so on and all their helpers, because others also did horrendous things and both have to be called out for it. Justification of unneccesary murdering shows you are in favor for that which is unacceptable
Are the people justifying these things in the room with us?
If the room is .ml, yes.
Who killed more Asians: US or Mao?
Hamas are arguably a gift for Israel.
If we take “kill” to mean like manslaughter through poor policy and famine, probably Mao, by an order of magnitude. But I’m guessing that’s not what you’re thinking about, because that’s kind of a silly comparison. It’s like asking “who killed more Americans, Mao or the US”, to which the answer is both obvious and completely uninteresting.
So I’m gonna take it to mean “murder”, like the killing of landlords during the cultural revolution. And then it’s actually kind of close, and I’m not sure who’s killed more Asians. So the most liberal estimates for Mao there are 7 million, but the range is pretty big. The most conservative estimates put him at 2 million.
Let’s look at the US’ kill count. I know of bombing campaigns in Korea, Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia. Respectively, the ranges here are 300k-2M, 1.5M-3.1M, 80k-350k, 50k-150k. So that’s a range of 1.9M-5.6M. Then there’s the suppression of the movement for independence in colonized phillipines, which adds 200k, and Afghanistan, 250k. So that puts us at 2.5M-6M for the US to 2-7 for Mao.
It should be noted that I’m not counting indirect deaths via training and arming dictatorships (if someone hands an assassin a gun, and the assassin kills your mother, the first person is not a murderer, but they are culpable in some way. If we add these, you get Timor, and the murder of leftists in Indonesia in the 60s, among others, which adds another 1-1.5M to the US count.
So I guess it’s kind of close. I gotta say, I’m a little surprised, I always thought Mao was much worse, but the US is a strong contender.
Woah! We skipped over the Pacific theater of WWII entirely it looks like.
Also skipping all MidEast action, but that can be considered a different tally for purposes of this exercise.
But realistically we should also have approximately similar timeframes for both- otherwise we just inflate US counts artificially.
You’re welcome to include Iraq, Iran, South America, Africa, Gaza, Turkish Kurds, and so on. You’re welcome to restrict to some arbitrary timeframe, you’re welcome to exclude indirect fatalities. Ultimately it’s a fairly futile exercise. But I do know that if we restrict to the period including the invasion of Vietnam by China and onward, the US “wins” very, very comfortably.
And I object to your use of the word artificial. These are human lives that were snuffed out for the sake of greed. These were people, like your father, your mother, your friends. There’s nothing artificial about these numbers.
That’s a good reply. 😁
Thank you. 🙂
It’s only a gift if you get it for free. Israel funded Hamas to make themselves look more sympathetic.
Israel got a good R.O.I.
Hard disagree.
Gaza was under siege by Israel, but it was coping.
Hamas then did their stupid attack on Putin’s 71st birthday, inflicting relatively insignificant damage to Israel;
but it was an excuse that Israel used/is using for the current bulldozing of Gaza (and, IIUC, more of the West Bank).
Perhaps when the Riviera has been fully developed, Netanyahu should send the leaders of Hamas some gift baskets.
The world is turning against Israel. Netanyahu is headed for a jail cell.
IIUC, 50 years ago, the UN GA passed a motion that Zionism was racism.
Did that scare the people of Israel?
I predict that Israel will still have relations with much of the world as dealing with Israel is more profitable than dealing with Arabs in Golan, West Bank, and Gaza; and Netanyahu won’t go to jail, particularly as his 80th birthday is less than 60 months away.
In Sweden the far-right tried to play this game. They started chirping about the social democrats being rasist and made a list on like an A4 with names and events. Then the same was done to them, matching the font, their list was taken up a skylift and holding one end they folded it out to the ground in a television program.
In the US, the ‘left’ would just amplify the voice of the far-right.
Good on Swedish voters for being less stupid than we are.
Well, I would not give them that much credit. The majority governing coallition is with the far-right. They were clear before the election they were going to work with the far-right. They have a common platform with the far right which has a large overlap with e.g. Trumps; mass deportation of immigrants (like for reasons like being a victim of a crime), slashing government agencies, extreme restrictions on free speech, and so on. It is just a bit slower here when it comes to reaching their goals.
Based
Man fascists are delusional , scratch a liberal and all that…
There’s those who commit unintended mistakes, then there’s those who give in to the temptation of behaving badly in their moments of weakness, and then there’s those who can’t wait for any given opportunity to behave maliciously and justify it by saying they aren’t the only ones doing it.
Hey, don’t judge me for commiting ethnic cleansing! Hitler did it as well, after all! And that one single bad apple in your group is mildly racist as well, so you’re no better!
Inb4 tankies go: “Abraham Lincoln was a racist, LiTEraLlY tHe sAmE as the southern slave owners” 🤡
Lately, they have been trying to tell me that North Korea is a democracy.
I mean it is in the name. The DEMOCRATIC People’s Republic of Korea.
Dumb libs can’t even read
I prefer the liberated Korea ,the south is the occupied Korea.
I lived in SK. It’s a racist shit hole. I’ve also been to NK for work and it’s absolutely and even bigger, darker, shit hole.
Wow, a country that experienced harsh Japanese colonial rule from 1910 until being forcibly divided by the US after the second world war, creating a war-torn pariah state facing crushing international economic sanctions, is a shit hole? Color me surprised!
If you’re willing to share, I would very much appreciate a new post about this.
They’d campaign hard against Lincoln for being a defender of slavery, despite him being the only anti-slavery candidate with a chance of winning in 1860.
They don’t care how many marginalized groups are beat, raped, starved, and murdered, so long as they can jerk themselves off over how pure (or nonexistent) their ballot was.
Here’s the tankie of the time. Liberals would be out defending the slave owners rights for free market ideals and the law . Possibly demanding that more women should be allowed to hold the whip. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Brown_(abolitionist)
John Brown, who was widely celebrated by Republicans in the Union? The ‘Liberals’ you so despise?
I’m not even usaian but I now that republican and democrats were the opposite sides compared to today. Are you deliberately trying to be dishonest or are you just stupid?
Also liberalism is a word usaians have a hard time grasping what it is. it’s a specific ideology not a party. Neoliberal ideas are shared on both heads of the US plutocracy
I’m not even usaian but I now that republican and democrats were the opposite sides compared to today.
Yes, and the Republicans of the time were very much liberals.
Are you deliberately trying to be dishonest or are you just stupid?
Big Dunning-Kruger energy.
Ah I take it as the first one there. Maybe you could have vote harder against slavery? John Brown is a terrorist for you. Not for me.
Maybe you could have vote harder against slavery?
So glad you made sure that shitlib Lincoln wasn’t elected, it would have been truly terrible if someone who wasn’t an unconditional supporter of slavery was in charge of the country.
Let’s not forget the current right winged idiocy claiming he’s a current Republican and the Democrats were racist.
Can we just rename this instance from politicalmemes to tankierants
Difficult to vote between genocide and genocide. At least with one you punished the other candidate for it.
Not this shit again lol Every single time
How dare I point out that Biden committed genocide. Have you no shame in yourself? Does it feel good to turn a blind eye to a modern day holocaust and pretend like nothing is happening?
Complete with the signature hysterical accusations and the misconstruing of the facts. 👏 Well done, you’ve become the meme of the post by thinking you’re doing something constructive but only shrieking nonsense and alienating people instead of making an resonating and true statement that we can rally behind.
Please don’t forget to also accuse me of contributing to genocide when I tell you that your shit stinks and is unhelpful and unproductive. Go ahead, say the line, Bart.
It’s crazy the amount of people that think the evil voters are at fault and not the political party that made a wedge issue out of fucking genocide of all things.
So glad the current guys got in! How’s that going for ya btw? That genocide stop? No? It’s accelerating? So glad more children can die so you can still confidently hold your nose in the air.
I hate the current guy even more. It seriously bothers me that the dems lost to him because they thought genocide was more important then you and me. I really wish they would have ran a proper platform, so we didnt have to vote for democracy and genocide at the same time, and still lose.
Keep blaming everyone but them and maybe we can have the same circus next election too. We all just have to come together and accept genocide, apathy and status quo like maybe three or four more times.
It seriously bothers me that the dems lost to him because they thought genocide was more important then you and me. I really wish they would have ran a proper platform, so we didnt have to vote for democracy and genocide at the same time, and still lose.
We will remember the devil’s bargain we were forced to answer, so will the rest of the world.
This is a watershed moment in world history.
Keep blaming everyone but them
I’m going to keep blaming stupid Americans because that’s where the fault primarily lies.
Oh no, a political party didn’t run a picture perfect campaign against a felon rapist’s racist fascist campaign. Guess that means we have to let the felon rapist win.
Do you know how many less fucks I give about 2 countries on the other side of the planet continuing an everlasting religious conflict compared to creeping fascism in my own fucking country?
American voters couldn’t see the forest for the trees, because they’re stupid. So now we sit squarely in the stupidest timeline.
Oh no, a political party didn’t run a picture perfect campaign against a felon rapist’s racist fascist campaign.
Oh no, a political party *threw a presidential campaign rather than win and risk acknowledging the humanity of Palestinians.
FTFY
next election too
next election? there won’t be an election next time, democracy is dead and you killed it.
good job on the protest vote, now that you have defeated the “status quo” gaza will be a luxurious hotel with golf courses instead, so much better, right?
do us a favor and go back to your tankie echo chambers / your right wing troll friends, depending on what you actually are
No, the Democrats killed it when they handed our democracy over to a facist on a silver platter. Rememer that they did this because they valued genocide and corporate donations more than they cared about beating trump.
“It’s all your fault for not doing what I wanted.”
Buddy, I’d be careful throwing those stones when your argument boils down to “It’s all your fault for not voting how I wanted.”
“It’s all your fault for not voting how I wanted.”
Well, that would have kept an actual fucking fascist out of office, sooooooooo…
Repeat after me: Israel is committing a genocide.
Yes they are.
As is Russia, half a dozen countries, and oh we stopped funding the who and usaid.
So we’re now aiding multiple genocides.
MISSION fucking ACCOMPLISHED.
I wish I read this earlier, but it feels refreshing to read even if I’m a few hours late.
Yeah, fucking duh! I’m not arguing that brain child.
Wait, you mean the thing that we told the Dems would happen, happened? Crazy, who could have seen that coming? It’s almost like we wanted them to be a party of decency, so we could tell people to vote for them without having to defend the killing of children.
Maybe next time, the Dems should put up a candidate people want to vote for, instead of shaming people for being against Genocide.
So glad that you held the country, and especially vulnerable populations like LGBTQ+, neurodivergent, immigrants, and disabled people, not to mention the Palestinian and Ukrainian people, hostage while demanding that Dems do things that have zero historical evidence of them agreeing to. I can’t speak for all of us but, I bet the others are also glad that you were able to keep your moral high-ground and didn’t feel at all betrayed and upset about it. /s
I always find it fascinating that people get mad at those that couldn’t stomach genocide, rather than getting mad at the people with the power, the money and the platform who chose genocide and money over fighting fascism. We kept telling the Democrats that their position was unpopular, they told us to sit down and shut up. Maybe the Democrats should play seriously next time.
I always find it fascinating that people get mad at those that couldn’t stomach genocide, rather than getting mad at the people with the power, the money and the platform who chose genocide and money over fighting fascism.
Do you get mad at a mountain lion for killing an elk? Or ivy for strangling a tree? It’s just what they do. Same with the corrupt elite and bourgeoisie. They’re corrupt and feed their own selfish desires because they are fundamentally broken, antisocial people. When one claims to be an ally but refuses to act like one in the most important and meaningful ways, it feels like betrayal and that hits differently than known malignancies acting malicious.
Maybe the Democrats should play seriously next time.
So glad you taught those Dems a lesson, I’m sure the elite in the DNC are going to be very harmed by this, and not the numerous marginalized groups on the ground.
And if they don’t learn their lesson, of course, you can just murder some more minorities next time! That will really show them!
Leftist here who voted for Kamala and is also a minority:
So glad you taught those Dems a lesson, I’m sure the elite in the DNC are going to be very harmed by this, and not the numerous marginalized groups on the ground.
You recognize that how you’re describing the situation is eerily close to the definition of collective punishment, right? “Don’t argue with the people in charge who have been screwing us over for the entirety of our lives and who are actively doing a genocide because at least they’re not gonna hurt us as bad”. That’s not an argument for keeping those people in power. Stop defending the people who are willfully causing the deaths of children halfway across the world because at least less people will die here. Stop trading Palestinian lives for American ones.
We have one enemy right now and it’s the billionaires who are actively and maliciously trying to keep us fighting against each other so that they can r*pe and decimate the working class. Shut the fuck up about who voted last election and for whom and actually gear up behind candidates that actually want to solve problems. The dem establishment does not give a shit about the working class. How many fucking articles have to come out basically spelling out for you that they are abandoning the working class? They’re courting corporate interest too. Get off the sinking ship and hold your fucking public servants accountable for their actions for once.
We have one enemy right now and it’s the billionaires
Go ahead and let me know which option in the 2024 election was best for billionaires.
I’ll wait.
Hint: It’s the one all the billionaires gave money to.
Shut the fuck up about who voted last election
No. It matters.
The dem establishment does not give a shit about the working class.
Their voting history literally proves you wrong.
You recognize that how you’re describing the situation is eerily close to the definition of collective punishment, right?
“Collective punishment is when you recognize that actions have consequences for everyone in society”
Yikes.
Stop trading Palestinian lives for American ones.
Oh cool, how many Palestinian lives did preferring the fascist save?
Oh, no Palestinians were saved?
In fact, more Palestinians are going to die now?
Stop trading American and Palestinian lives for your own ego.
Shut the fuck up about who voted last election and for whom and actually gear up behind candidates that actually want to solve problems.
Don’t worry, any time there’s a candidate who might end up with a chance of preventing fascism, I’m sure you’ll find a reason to asspat everyone who sabotages that candidate.
I’m sure that if you just encourage this self-destructive behavior and praise the ‘bravery’ of those who engage in purity-test insanity at the cost of the lives of people like us more, it’ll make the next anti-fascist coalition that much more likely to succeed. Less support for an anti-fascist coalition is better, right?
The dem establishment does not give a shit about the working class.
Okay. Cool. Would you like to remind me what the pro-working class options were in 2024?
We were offered a punch in the face or a .50 cal through the head, and you’re sitting here defending people who opted for the .50 cal because a punch in the face is bad. No shit a punch in the face is bad. But anyone who can’t see the difference between the two, or a reason to support one over the other when it comes down to the wire, is the exact kind of purity-obsessed ghoul who would’ve opposed supporting the USSR and USA against Nazi Germany during WW2. “Good job on sending Poles to the death camps, you really showed those Just-As-Bad Allied tyrants that you’ll never work with Bad People™!”
Palestine wedge issue
I always find it fascinating that people get mad at those that couldn’t stomach genocide
Hey kid, know what’s worse than genocide on the other side of the planet?
Fascism at home!!!
Thanks for coming to my TED Talk. Maybe you fucking learned something.
Wait, you mean the thing that we told the Dems would happen, happened?
Yes, you successfully ushered in fascism, just like you threatened to do. Give yourself a pat on the back.
It was not a threat, it was a warning. If you keep putting up bad candidates and bad policies, people aren’t going to want to vote for you. I voted against fascism. The Democrats told me to sit down and shut up so that they could assist in ushering in fascism. Get mad at them, not me.
The Democrats told me to sit down and shut up so that they could assist in ushering in fascism.
Are you on meth?
It was not a threat, it was a warning.
“I’m warning you, I’m going to support fascism if you don’t change your platform (after which, of course, I will find some other policy to make this identical demand on)”
But I didn’t support fascism. I voted against it. And I told the Democrats that it was unpopular and they didn’t care.
And yes, genocide is one out of a hundred other policies that I don’t support the Democrats because of. Maybe bombing kids, or bankrupting people with hospital bills, or imprisoning people for life for minor crimes, or deporting immigrants, or supporting rapists isn’t a big deal to you, but it is for me.
But I didn’t support fascism. I voted against it.
Is that “I don’t understand math” or “I’m refusing to engage in introspection of any sort because I only want the world around me to be at fault”?
There’s no point, the Russians just needed to give them an excuse to throw temper tantrums, they didn’t even have to push that hard.
Of course I’m russian. It couldn’t possible be that I am against the murder of the innocent, or against rapists, or against open corruption, or against torture and imprisonment. I can only point out the obvious failings of the party with terrible approval ratings because I’m a foreign agent.
Welcome to reality, and adulthood, where, more often than not, you are working to mitigate shitty situations to get the least destructive outcome possible.
Americans failed to do so, because they chose to squabble over a party not being perfect while a felon rapist and his enabling party of fascists took complete control.
Maybe next time (if there is one) we can cry again about the party that’s provably better for average Americans while we descend further into fascism. That’ll make things better.
…chose to squabble over a party not being perfect…
Looking at the party for the last few years, I see: Choosing a rapist, child-killing, genocide supporter as the candidate. Gaslighting everyone on the cognitive abilities of said candidate. Continuously screwing over the working class. Gaslighting everyone on the state of the economy. Bailing out their rich friends, while telling the poor and homeless that they need to suck it up. Propping up the fascist that beat them as their opponent. Bombing innocent people. Saying that they would be harder on immigrants than the fascist. Helping build a stupid border wall. Increasing funding to violent assholes that attack the working class. Picking unpopular candidates and running on right-wing values.
I feel like that is a far cry from “not being perfect”
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You brain-dead college kid protesters don’t know what “gEnOciDe” is.
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If you ever actually went to Gaza, you’d almost immediately be murdered, enslaved, or imprisoned by the Hamas terrorists you’ve been brainwashed in to believing are the “good guys”.
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Biden was clearly the better choice for Gaza no matter how much copium you huff or how much you wish it wasn’t true.
Anyhow, enjoy watching the Trump Casino/Resort Gaza being built atop the bones of dead Palestinian kids, chump, because it’s what you supported. “Trump Gaza, number one!”
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Maybe next time
yeah sure there’s gonna be a next time… keep hoping, buddy
Well, I’m not sure if theres gonna be a next time or not. I assume Trump is gonna fight his damndest to make sure there isn’t another vote. If there is another vote, I assume it’s gonna be Trump, and a highly unpopular Democrat because they still can’t be bothered to give a shit about fighting fascism.
because they still can’t be bothered to give a shit about fighting fascism.
Lol. They ran a campaign repeatedly explaining the dangers of another Trump presidency to the American people. But Americans were too concerned about a conflict on the other side of the planet to care about fascism at home.
The other comments are right. Your brain is broken.
So you’re saying it’s not any fascist’s fault for voting for a fascist, because they were manipulated?
I think they are referring to the protest non voters because of the Palestine Israeli conflict.
Oh, well that’s okay. Nobody has a moral obligation to resist fascism. Calling people evil for letting a neo-nazi wannabe dictator take control of the government is absurd
/s
Your totally right. It’s OK to support genocide because the “good” party (that builds the infrastructure for facism, and doesn’t fight against it) is such a better option. I mean, how can people not be supportive of that?
/s
You killed 10 Gazas by letting trump win.
In opposing 1 genocide you chose 10 more, and threw away any hope to resist them.
So many dying kids curse you right now.
I didn’t “let” Trump win, I voted against him. The Democrats handed the election to him because they valued genocide and money more than they valued fighting fascism. The Democrats openly bombed the shit out of kids world-wide. Do you think they were happy with you when Biden was bombing them? or do you think they cursed as they were dying?
They didn’t hand shit.
Nobody should have voted FOR Harris.
Everyone should have voted AGAINST Trump.
It’s childish to even have this discussion.
If the dems had literally run Mitt Romney I would have voted for him gladly.
Becauae, unlike you, I don’t want MORE genocide, and Trump is nothing if not openly pro-genocide.
Are you happy you didn’t “support genocide”? Did it make the world a better place?
I am indeed happy that I didn’t “support genocide”. But no, it didn’t make the world a better place. Are you happy that you supported genocide? Did that make the world a better place?
Funnily enough your moral high grounding resulted in school lunch programs being discontinued. So good job now we have a genocide AND more hungry kids domestically
Are you happy that you supported genocide?
The fact that you think people who supported Democrats supported genocide is infantile and shows that you are arguing in bad faith.
