The European Union on Sunday condemned Hamas for using "hospitals and civilians as human shields" in Gaza, while also urging Israel to show "maximum restraint" to protect civilians.
This is not as easy as you think. You have to get your team to the target, through terrorists hiding among civilians, through IDE’s that are hidden along the way, through civilians that do not like you. And if you miraculously survive this march without heavy casualties the Hamas are already gone and hide somewhere else…not to forget the civilian casualties that would happen on the way…
From a tactical perspective it’s a goddamn war crime. When should they stop, then? When no native Palestinian remains, so they can swoop in and take all of Gaza like they’ve been trying to do for the last 70 years? Hamas is a response to decades of ethnic cleansing and Israel is using it as an excuse to further their conquest
Edit: this isn’t necessarily directed at OP. It’s more of an open ended question for those in support of the bombings
As far as international law goes no this is not a war crime.
If your military takes refuge or uses a civilian center for military operation then that location becomes a valid military target regardless of the risk to civilian lives.
Basically Hamas is commiting the crime by purposefully setting up in these areas. Once they do that then civilian death is acceptable collateral damage, legally speaking.
The point I’m making is both of those situations happened (good banks got bombed immediately after the convoy left and they have been using white phosphorus on people) and people are just looking the other way.
The news media made the same claims against the US concerning white phosphorous and that was not true so my burden of proof concerning white phosphorous is so high it actually supports the opposing narrative without some damn good evidence.
Not if you look at it from Israel’s point of view. The bombing results in less casualites on their side and still hurts the Hamas. I know this sounds cruel and I strongly condemn the civilian casualites, but from a tactical perspective it absolute makes sense and Israel has not that many options, Hamas made it very clear that they will continue so they have to fight them.
No it doesn’t make fuckin sense unless you don’t understand why hamas exists. Let’s assume that Palestinians aren’t people, and it’s morally acceptable to kill dozens of them to get one or two Hamas guys. Now, you have a ton of family members of those dead people who are extremely angry at Israel for killing their family and friends. Do you think those people just sit down and die quietly? No, quite a few of them join a terrorist organization to fight back. So now, by bombing that hospital, you’ve created more terrorists than you’ve killed.
“Let’s assume that Israelis aren’t people, and it’s morally acceptable to kill dozens of them to get one or two IDF guys. Now, you have a ton of family members of those dead people who are extremely angry at Hamas for killing their family and friends. Do you think those people just sit down and die quietly? No, quite a few of them join the IDF to fight back. So now, by attacking the concert, you’ve created more enemies than you’ve killed.”
If Hamas was freedom fighters, then your exact same defense applies to the Israeli military, and it’s a neverending cycle of “justified” violence.
But, Hamas are NOT freedom fighters. They want the war to continue in perpetuity and they’re keeping supplies from the civilians. They are a terrorist organization completely distinct from the Palestinians, that is also oppressing the Palestinians.
Hamas’ goal is to provoke Israel into the most violent responses possible. They want Israel to be genocidal. It makes Israel lose support and it’s more likely for countries like Iran to join the fight. They would be more than happy with all Palestinians dying if it meant killing all the Israelis too. Because they are a terrorist group.
If Hamas was freedom fighters, then your exact same defense applies to the Israeli military, and it’s a neverending cycle of “justified” violence.
Yeah. That’s true. There will be continued death and destruction until Israel tries for peace by undermining Hamas politically, not violently. Or until Israel ethnically cleanses the vast majority of Palestinians, which it seems like they’re trying to do.
Hamas is a resistance group, even if their tactics are awful. Their goal isn’t to provoke the most awful Israeli responses possible, but to retaliate for the violence that the IDF does. This has been the case for a while, and October 7th is really the main exception because I doubt Hamas predicted how far they’d get. Even with the Oct 7 attack, Hamas literally tried to trade their hostages for women and children in Israeli prisons. They tried to use their hostages as leverage to get Israel to stop bombing civilians as much. They have to care about Palestinians to some extent, because if enough citizens of Gaza decide the PA is a lot better, Hamas won’t exist anymore, or at least lose power.
Because they are a terrorist group.
You say this like it means anything. The ANC (fought apartheid south africa) was also a terrorist group. So was the FLN (fought french in the Algerian revolution), the Viet Minh (first Indochina war, against the french), and many other resistance groups.
This is not as easy as you think. You have to get your team to the target, through terrorists hiding among civilians, through IDE’s that are hidden along the way, through civilians that do not like you. And if you miraculously survive this march without heavy casualties the Hamas are already gone and hide somewhere else…not to forget the civilian casualties that would happen on the way…
jUst sEnd A sTriKe tEam lmao
Idiots thought modern warfare was a documentary
So bombing hospitals is the right answer? Really Israel needs to just fucking ceasefire.
From a tactical perspective it is. A ceasefire would help the civilians but also would benefit the Hamas…it’s a double edged sword.
From a tactical perspective it’s a goddamn war crime. When should they stop, then? When no native Palestinian remains, so they can swoop in and take all of Gaza like they’ve been trying to do for the last 70 years? Hamas is a response to decades of ethnic cleansing and Israel is using it as an excuse to further their conquest
Edit: this isn’t necessarily directed at OP. It’s more of an open ended question for those in support of the bombings
As far as international law goes no this is not a war crime.
If your military takes refuge or uses a civilian center for military operation then that location becomes a valid military target regardless of the risk to civilian lives.
Basically Hamas is commiting the crime by purposefully setting up in these areas. Once they do that then civilian death is acceptable collateral damage, legally speaking.
What about bombing humanitarian aide locations or using white phosphorus as a weapon?
Same thing applies to humanitarian aid.
If Hamas has hijacked or is operating in those places then they become military targets.
As far as white phosphorus, it depends on how it’s deployed. If it’s deployed for masking, tracing or identifying then it’s legal.
If it’s being directly used as an incendiary then that’s illegal.
The point I’m making is both of those situations happened (good banks got bombed immediately after the convoy left and they have been using white phosphorus on people) and people are just looking the other way.
The news media made the same claims against the US concerning white phosphorous and that was not true so my burden of proof concerning white phosphorous is so high it actually supports the opposing narrative without some damn good evidence.
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Rather just bomb the fucking place and move on.
Should’ve added an /s eh
Not if you look at it from Israel’s point of view. The bombing results in less casualites on their side and still hurts the Hamas. I know this sounds cruel and I strongly condemn the civilian casualites, but from a tactical perspective it absolute makes sense and Israel has not that many options, Hamas made it very clear that they will continue so they have to fight them.
No it doesn’t make fuckin sense unless you don’t understand why hamas exists. Let’s assume that Palestinians aren’t people, and it’s morally acceptable to kill dozens of them to get one or two Hamas guys. Now, you have a ton of family members of those dead people who are extremely angry at Israel for killing their family and friends. Do you think those people just sit down and die quietly? No, quite a few of them join a terrorist organization to fight back. So now, by bombing that hospital, you’ve created more terrorists than you’ve killed.
If Hamas was freedom fighters, then your exact same defense applies to the Israeli military, and it’s a neverending cycle of “justified” violence.
But, Hamas are NOT freedom fighters. They want the war to continue in perpetuity and they’re keeping supplies from the civilians. They are a terrorist organization completely distinct from the Palestinians, that is also oppressing the Palestinians.
Hamas’ goal is to provoke Israel into the most violent responses possible. They want Israel to be genocidal. It makes Israel lose support and it’s more likely for countries like Iran to join the fight. They would be more than happy with all Palestinians dying if it meant killing all the Israelis too. Because they are a terrorist group.
Yeah. That’s true. There will be continued death and destruction until Israel tries for peace by undermining Hamas politically, not violently. Or until Israel ethnically cleanses the vast majority of Palestinians, which it seems like they’re trying to do.
Hamas is a resistance group, even if their tactics are awful. Their goal isn’t to provoke the most awful Israeli responses possible, but to retaliate for the violence that the IDF does. This has been the case for a while, and October 7th is really the main exception because I doubt Hamas predicted how far they’d get. Even with the Oct 7 attack, Hamas literally tried to trade their hostages for women and children in Israeli prisons. They tried to use their hostages as leverage to get Israel to stop bombing civilians as much. They have to care about Palestinians to some extent, because if enough citizens of Gaza decide the PA is a lot better, Hamas won’t exist anymore, or at least lose power.
You say this like it means anything. The ANC (fought apartheid south africa) was also a terrorist group. So was the FLN (fought french in the Algerian revolution), the Viet Minh (first Indochina war, against the french), and many other resistance groups.
I’m amazed people are so stupid they still haven’t realized if you kill one innocent guy you just created 3 freedom fighters.