I’m curious how the tragic death of 1400 civilians justifies this genocide against an entire ethnic group…
There are many ways to address this problem, without unending airstrikes, and starving out 2 million people.
Invite the UN to come in and secure Gaza militarily
Provide free passage from the West Bank to Gaza or Gaza to the West Bank. Including peacekeeping soldiers from the “less radical” Palestinian government…
Allow civilians to move to the West Bank, and then completely level Gaza. After all the civilians leave. I’m sure it wouldn’t be popular, but it would save lives
Long-term, create economic diplomacy, intertwine the economies so there isn’t such a have have not disparity. Make people think the future is going to be better. Together.
Longer term, if the countries can’t be split, start integrating the populations. South African style apartheid truth and reconciliation on both sides, and get the populations to integrate, if they can’t be separate countries they have to learn to live together.
It wasn’t “tragic deaths”. Hamas terrorists shot indiscriminately on people on a music festival and took about 200 people hostage. It’s murder and terrorism.
You forgot one important step 0: honesty from both sides and a stop of propaganda and people cuddling terrorists.
Okay. So the murder and terrorism of 1400 people justifies the genocide of an ethnicity? I just want to understand where you draw the line. Because apparently we’re already past the genocide line and I want to know where that was
If Israel wants genocide why didn’t they do it already? Why do they let Palestinians live inside of Israel and don’t attack the Westbank with bombs as well?
Because they want an excuse to do it in the eyes of the international community and the less extreme of their own population. So they systematically oppressed the Palestinian population, which of course bred terrorism. They then made it more difficult for a peaceful Palestinian government as well, which made Hamas more powerful.
They didn’t listen to the warnings from Egypt that this attack was coming. Now they have the excuse they were waiting for to genocide the Palestinians.
If your country was being systematically dismantled by a much wealthier more powerful neighbour do you really think that you wouldn’t want to lash out? What Hamas did was terrible but it was a result of the long running actions of Israel
Following your rhetoric Israelis who are predominantly Jewish and Israel which was supposed to be the one safe place for Jews, Israel should have every right to defend themselves. Since they were oppressed and killed since ancient times.
They have the right to defend, not to genocide. The vast vast majority of the people they’ve killed in Gaza have been civilians & they’re committing a war crime by cutting off the water to Gaza. That’s not self defence
According to the UN definition they are already doing it.
You still haven’t answered the core question though, at what point is genocide okay? Where’s the line? Because I’m having trouble reading all the rhetoric, especially some of your posts, and understanding where a population has a right to exist, and when they don’t.
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group
Following this definition, Hamas wants to commit genocide and Israel doesn’t. So tell me why do you think genocide is okay when it is targeting Israelis?
I’m not pro Hamas. I do not agree with their ideology.
The Gaza strip situation is genocide by the definition in part a national identity, which is tied to ethnicity, which is tied to religion, is being destroyed and displaced. We just have to look to the political justifications from the military leadership, to see that the intention is to destroy.
And you still have not answered the question, when is genocide okay? Cuz apparently it’s okay now for the Israeli military to wipe Gaza off the map. And I want to know where that line is and you don’t answer that. Why don’t you answer that?
Great! After four back and forths we finally agree that genocide is not okay. Common ground! I’m glad we’ve communicated to this point.
So it seems our only disagreement, is if the Gaza bombings, in upcoming military incursion count as genocide.
A. Killing members of the group - Israel has made it clear that they wish to destroy the national group of Hamas and all of their supporters, which has been indicated to be every citizen of the Gaza strip.
B. Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group! Let’s ignore the bodily harm, the constant bombing is driving every person in the Gaza strip mad. The full embargo is also creating a humanitarian emergency for every person in the Gaza strip
C. Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction and whole or in part. The humanitarian embargo, The bombings, and the political rhetoric about leveling the Gaza strip.
I’m curious how the tragic death of 1400 civilians justifies this genocide against an entire ethnic group…
There are many ways to address this problem, without unending airstrikes, and starving out 2 million people.
Invite the UN to come in and secure Gaza militarily
Provide free passage from the West Bank to Gaza or Gaza to the West Bank. Including peacekeeping soldiers from the “less radical” Palestinian government…
Allow civilians to move to the West Bank, and then completely level Gaza. After all the civilians leave. I’m sure it wouldn’t be popular, but it would save lives
Long-term, create economic diplomacy, intertwine the economies so there isn’t such a have have not disparity. Make people think the future is going to be better. Together.
Longer term, if the countries can’t be split, start integrating the populations. South African style apartheid truth and reconciliation on both sides, and get the populations to integrate, if they can’t be separate countries they have to learn to live together.
It wasn’t “tragic deaths”. Hamas terrorists shot indiscriminately on people on a music festival and took about 200 people hostage. It’s murder and terrorism. You forgot one important step 0: honesty from both sides and a stop of propaganda and people cuddling terrorists.
Okay. So the murder and terrorism of 1400 people justifies the genocide of an ethnicity? I just want to understand where you draw the line. Because apparently we’re already past the genocide line and I want to know where that was
If Israel wants genocide why didn’t they do it already? Why do they let Palestinians live inside of Israel and don’t attack the Westbank with bombs as well?
Because they want an excuse to do it in the eyes of the international community and the less extreme of their own population. So they systematically oppressed the Palestinian population, which of course bred terrorism. They then made it more difficult for a peaceful Palestinian government as well, which made Hamas more powerful.
They didn’t listen to the warnings from Egypt that this attack was coming. Now they have the excuse they were waiting for to genocide the Palestinians.
If your country was being systematically dismantled by a much wealthier more powerful neighbour do you really think that you wouldn’t want to lash out? What Hamas did was terrible but it was a result of the long running actions of Israel
Following your rhetoric Israelis who are predominantly Jewish and Israel which was supposed to be the one safe place for Jews, Israel should have every right to defend themselves. Since they were oppressed and killed since ancient times.
They have the right to defend, not to genocide. The vast vast majority of the people they’ve killed in Gaza have been civilians & they’re committing a war crime by cutting off the water to Gaza. That’s not self defence
https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/genocide.shtml
According to the UN definition they are already doing it.
You still haven’t answered the core question though, at what point is genocide okay? Where’s the line? Because I’m having trouble reading all the rhetoric, especially some of your posts, and understanding where a population has a right to exist, and when they don’t.
The UN definition:
Following this definition, Hamas wants to commit genocide and Israel doesn’t. So tell me why do you think genocide is okay when it is targeting Israelis?
I’m not pro Hamas. I do not agree with their ideology.
The Gaza strip situation is genocide by the definition in part a national identity, which is tied to ethnicity, which is tied to religion, is being destroyed and displaced. We just have to look to the political justifications from the military leadership, to see that the intention is to destroy.
And you still have not answered the question, when is genocide okay? Cuz apparently it’s okay now for the Israeli military to wipe Gaza off the map. And I want to know where that line is and you don’t answer that. Why don’t you answer that?
You are building a strawman. Genocide is never okay, I believe Hamas is trying to commit genocide and Israel is not.
Great! After four back and forths we finally agree that genocide is not okay. Common ground! I’m glad we’ve communicated to this point.
So it seems our only disagreement, is if the Gaza bombings, in upcoming military incursion count as genocide.
A. Killing members of the group - Israel has made it clear that they wish to destroy the national group of Hamas and all of their supporters, which has been indicated to be every citizen of the Gaza strip.
B. Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group! Let’s ignore the bodily harm, the constant bombing is driving every person in the Gaza strip mad. The full embargo is also creating a humanitarian emergency for every person in the Gaza strip
C. Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction and whole or in part. The humanitarian embargo, The bombings, and the political rhetoric about leveling the Gaza strip.
I’m an outsider, I am neither Israeli nor Palestinian. Maybe you don’t trust my interpretation, that’s fine. Would you believe Jewish scholars? https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/oct/18/israel-gaza-hamas-palestinians