Taliban’s religious police reportedly burned a number of musical instruments in the western province of Herat, according to a Sunday report by the state-run news agency Bakhtar.
Sheikh Aziz al-Rahman al-Muhajir, the provincial head of the Ministry of Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice, said music led to “misguidance of the youth and the destruction of society,” according to the report.
People could be corrupted, according to the official. The Taliban banned nonreligious music the last time it ruled the country in the 1990s.
Pictures show officials gathered around a fire with musical instruments, including guitars, harmoniums and speakers. A pile of musical instruments burn as the Taliban imposes new restrictions on music
Afghanistan has a strong musical tradition, influenced by Iranian and Indian classical music.
It also has a thriving pop music scene, adding electronic instruments and dance beats to more traditional rhythms.
Both flourished in the past 20 years before the Taliban stormed to power in 2021.
But the Taliban has imposed harsh measures since seizing control of Afghanistan in August 2021 as US and NATO forces withdrew.
Students and teachers of the Afghanistan National Institute of Music, which was once famous for its inclusiveness, have not returned to classes since the Taliban takeover. Many musicians have also fled the country.
Taliban’s crackdown on women’s rights
The Taliban promised a more moderate rule than that of their previous time in power in the 1990s. They had promised to allow for women’s and minority rights. But instead, they reintroduced harsh measures in line with their strict interpretation of Islamic law, or Sharia.
They have carried out public executions, banned education for girls beyond the sixth grade and also banned women from most forms of employment.
Earlier this week, the Taliban announced that all beauty salons ought to be closed because they offered services forbidden by Islam and caused economic hardship for the families of grooms during wedding festivities.
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American evangelicals would like to have a word with you. I mean fuck the Taliban they’re horrible. But they’re not all that special or unique. Nor are they representative of Islam as a whole. And even there we should be admonishing Christians as much as we seem to want to admonish islamists.
like all religions taken to their core extremism
Let’s stop for a minute and think. If their version of god an religion were true, would you really like to worship an asshole god who hates music or anything fun?
Might as well go to hell. At least they’d have music.
I know. Not really about god, but about control.
I really wonder if people like this have a playbook, like have they read history and put together a step by step guide at this point for maximizing assholery, or does behavior like this sort of emerge naturally as the assholes take control? Like why do we see this over and over in authoritarian regimes, is it natural or are they copycats?
Sidebar: today I learned the word assholery is a real word, I thought I just made it up lol
It has nothing to do with being an asshole, it’s an attempt to enforce your will on people. That’s why the actions always look identical, everyone is attempting the exact same thing, to control the behavior of all citizens under their rule until it conforms with whatever standard the government wishes.
Major dick move ngl
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Who woulda thunk it!?
Ministry of Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice
Better known as the Anti-Fun Police.
Deeply un-Islamic. The history of Arab and Islamic music goes back right to the birth of the religion and the life of Muhammad himself.
As with all religious stuff, that’s just your opinion. The sahih bukhari suggests otherwise, putting music in the same vein as ‘illegal sexual intercourse’ (and wearing silk, cuz why not lmao)
I agree but can you share more history or a source? I work in a school and some members of my community opt out of music for religious reasons which I think is BS and a totally extreme view. I don’t think it is in the Quran bit someone told me it is in the hadith.
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That’ll teach them, stoopid noise makin tings
But burn a Koran and they’ll hunt you down
Idiots
Assholes
Someone should really defeat those guys in a war and teach them a lesson.
We did. As soon as we left they went right back to their old ways.
Kick yo ass den we gonna come home
(continuing the headline)… And Produce Some Sweet Album Cover Art
How easy is for an afghan citizen to flee the country? Is it a north-korea-like situation? I’m not well informed about this topic!
Depends who you are, I guess. For women, leaving alone is very difficult if not impossible as you would need a male guardian to escort you.
As a man it it’s easier but comes down to the money. Most people there are very poor and in a country where family an tribal ties are really important, it is very difficult to pack up your things and leave.
Also, poor Afgan refugees are not received very well by other countries. They are also afraid of the lunacy of the fundamentalist religious movement spreading.
Like any country Afganistan has wealthy people too and for them leaving is probably the easiest.
On general note, Afganistan is a prime example of what a fundamentalist leadership and religion can lead to. Can happen in other countries and outside of Islam too. We should be aware of this.
On general note, Afganistan is a prime example of what a fundamentalist leadership and religion can lead to. Can happen in other countries and outside of Islam too. We should be aware of this.
Thank you for adding that paragraph.
Nobody should be complacent thinking “it can’t happen here”.
It can. Religious zealots will always try to chip away at secular freedoms, arrogantly confident that they’re doing their God’s work.
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It’s hard enough to get one visa, good luck getting four
Sorry, I’m bad at math (even though it was a rhetorical question) 😃
I’d like to point out however, that while having 4 wives might be allowed in some branches of Islam, there are others where this is not the case. So while Taliban might allow it (and I don’t know whether they do as I am not an expert, but I’m currently too lazy to check it out), not everyone in the Muslim world does.
I say this because us living in the west have a very limited view of Islam and generally it is bad to enforce stereotypes. So this was not aimed against you, just pointing out something that bothers me in general 🙂
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there is a completely different islam being followed in americia.
Yes, in fact there are many different types of Islam followed in different countries. America is not unique in that way. Even within many Muslim countries there are different sects of worshippers. Not everyone follows the mainstream interpretation.
you guys think of islam as a completely peaceful religion.
I certainly don’t think that, nor does anyone with any common sense. As well as no one should consider Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism or even Buddishm as completely peaceful. Every religion has built within it a framework that can be used to promote and justify violence.
I don’t understand how rest of your post relates to what was said before, but I than you for the info you provided.
Here’s a more detailed info about polygamy in different countries: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2020/12/07/polygamy-is-rare-around-the-world-and-mostly-confined-to-a-few-regions/
Holy crap I didn’t realize it was accepted so much in the Pacific. That’s crazy.
That’s so depressing… (thank you for the elaborated reply)
Somebody’s brought a Yamaha cp80 to Afghanistan only to have it burned. I suppose this somehow helps allah
Maybe he made them do that, so he can finally fulfil his dream of leading his own big band.
they’re gonna have to burn all the computers too. Is ASIO and Core Audio haram too?
Neanderthals
Nah, I think there is evidence that Neandertals appreciated the arts. These people are just jerks.
This is the society Afghans want. They were given 20 years to build a foundation against a re-emergence of Taliban. They choose corruption and paper soldiers.
Never have a so large army been beaten to fast with so few bullets fired.
If they want to live in a religious hellhole. Let them.
I have buddies that served in Afghanistan and what I’ll share will sound shitty, but reality sometimes is simply shitty.
The country is just full of uneducated superstitious, goat herders. There isn’t real allegiance to “Afghanistan” as a country, so building a unified democracy is/was pretty much impossible.
They were training Afghan troops but would never turn their backs on them lol, they said they’d frequently try to pull shit and the concept of discipline, leadership that you need for a stable military / police simply isn’t in the culture.
People were hoping for post ww2 Germany, but Germany was a country filled with educated people with a history of order Afghanistan has just been tribes at war for decades… There was no way to make it work.
That’s not to say that Afghanistan doesn’t have good people in it that just want peace feed their family and live, but at its current state it’s not going to be anything but a theocratic hell hole.
There isn’t real allegiance to “Afghanistan” as a country, so building a unified democracy is/was pretty much impossible.
That’s the core of the matter. There is no “Afghanistan”. There are just many, many tribes. Until the tribal mindset goes away, nothing will change.
This is a problem in many countries. it’s in part a consequence of the haphazardly manner in which the border were drawn, and maybe of a lack of exposure to more than a few valleys.
The podcast Through line episode 199 and 200 covers this pretty good. Episode 199 is called Afghanistan: the center of the world.
Great listen.
I have to admit, it kind of shocks me that so few people in Afghanistan were unwilling to fight the Taliban when they knew just how bad they were/could be. People were desperate enough to try clinging to the exterior of planes when western forces were leaving, but not desperate enough to fight back. I don’t know, it’s tragic and confusing at the same time.
Uh, they’ve been in war like state most of the time since 1970s. Wars caused by outsiders. I’m pretty sure that at this point, most people just want to live in peace, no matter how shitty that peace is.
This is in part where the Taliban’s strength stems from: at least they are domestic oppressors, not troops from abroad.
I can definitely, at least in part, see that a domestic oppressor is “better” than foreign troops, and I’m not trying to sa that “this is all the Afghanis fault” or anything similar. The troubles and tragedy in Afghanistan are very clearly largely the fault of foreign governments the past 50-ish years. What confuses me is all the people willing to risk so much to get out, or the people that appreciated the freedoms they had when they were not under Taliban rule, not being willing to take the same risks by fighting the Taliban and preventing them from getting to power in the first place.
I guess it comes down to this: They had ≈20 years to build up the education and political systems, as well as the military strength to withstand the Taliban. As long as western forces were deployed, there were plenty of Afghani troops and police risking their lives to protect those systems. But once western troops left, so many of them threw down their weapons and fled. I have a hard time understanding why.
I think there is a widely shared misconcpetion in the West that the models and values of a society and governance are universal. This is a very colonial mindset, even when the intent is benevolent.
Note that I am not an expert on Afghan society so if someone knows better, please correct me.
My perspective is, and like others here have pointed out, that Afghanistan has never been a state in the sense we understand states being. Concepts such as central government, civil society, national army were brought in by the English in the 19th century. Small parts of the society were organized based on western ideals (in supervision of the Brits) but most of the country remained decentralized, traditionalist and tribal. This is not to say that this is somehow worse, it is an ancient way of life with very rich traditions and it is something that has kept people in there are alive for centuries. For big part of the country things like nationalism, democracy, institutions, politics etc. are just indifferent.
With background like this it’s no wonder Afghans were not able to build a society that mimicis western ideals. 20 years (or even 50) is a relatively short time when compared to traditions and interpretations of religion that have existed for hundreds of years. Sure, some people benefitted from the British, Soviet and the US presence, but i’d guess those that genuinely wanted to turn Afghanistan into a modern state, were in a great minority. In a society based on family and tribal ties, things like politics or civil society don’t mean much if anything. Ethics are very different from the European traditions too.
Unfortunately Taleban is the only group there with power and organization that can form anything resembling a centralized nation state. The problem is that they are fundamentalist lunatics. While there are people who oppose them, it is very difficult to get enough people organized and overcome the fear of brutal punishments by the regime.
Because the civil society is small and disorganized, most of the people are apolitical and couldn’t care less how the society is organized. I’d wager that most men in any position care about making a living and being left alone. Those who don’t, try to leave the country. There just isn’t a structure that allows for a major rebellion.
Let them.
Their children will suffer. And not all Afghans are like that.
The main problem, as with many things, is a severe lack of education.
Sure. But burning musical instruments? That is just idiotic. What level of fear is that serving? I don’t get it.
Christians also had this for time, until they figured out how to use music for marketing Christianity.
The whole point of those monotonous songs in churches is that they’re not exciting, not titillating.
To be fair, the first Christians were instructed to pull their eyes out to prevent seeing something that leads to sinful thoughts.
Some historical quotes to get a sense of it: https://www.bible.ca/H-music.htm
