I’ve seen it pop up in quite a few threads, sometimes in jest (or sort of in-jest), but I think it comes up enough to talk about seriously, both from an individual behaviour standpoint and a broader activism/socialism/whatever standpoint.
This is also coming from someone that sees themselves as very extroverted (but also autistic and socially anxious, so pretty poor at getting my social needs met), so maybe this whole idea is way off base.
There’s two narratives here for discussion in this thread:
- I struggle with pushing myself to be social, and I am afraid this makes me a poor activist. At some point or another advocating for socialism will rely on socialists to talk to non-socialists in spaces and circumstances that are not comfortable.
- Socialism, on some level, involves a society with more time and space to socialise. What will this look like for a severe introvert? Will there be room for a person to buy a plot of land in the hills and live separate from society forever? Will I have to go to Commissar DanceClass’s Dance Class?
And two sentiments that should be discussed with those narratives re: other people:
- Introvert, socially anxious, autistic etc. There are people they get along with and comfortable social situations, but for a variety of reasons need a break regularly
- “I just hate people”
This whole post was a thought I had when reading the second people-hater. My initial thought was that this was an internal pathologisation of people based on the society we live in. If the only people you encounter day to day are ladder climbing suburbanites whose main interests are competitively assessing lawn heights and promotions, you’re probably going to “hate people”. However, this may not be the case for all people who claim this of themselves. Maybe they hate other people on the road, people in queues for groceries etc. I just find it hard to believe that someone who genuinely hates all people would hop on to a forum (an entirely social activity) and spend any amount of time there. Nonetheless, it probably happens.
But, I figured that the topic had enough range and nuance to turn into its own thread instead of responding directly, and saw someone else post the introvert activism thing.
One of the things I thought of was the social battery and how it’s often expended on work and commuting. If your main social energy is spent at work/commuting, I feel like it’s very possible that one might come away with a dim view of any social activity (incl. organising) and your ability to participate in it, especially if you’d largely done it since school (another cutthroat highly hierarchical social setting).
(how is commuting social? You’re in a constant negotiation with other drivers to avoid bumping your 2 ton $20k machines into each other, with a wide variety of levels of aggression, empathy, engagement etc. It’s not words, but there is a communication there that can be very draining)
Capitalism sucks for introverts by requiring not just that most people work, but work for 8+ hours a day in an “open seating plan” under fluorescent lights with little time to recharge afterward. Not to mention driving home or riding transit, which are both highly social in a different way. Then if you want to maintain relationships with your friends and family, they probably miss you since you have been gone all day.
Work is social as long as society exists. The degree of social interaction skyrocketed with the Industrial Revolution and the advent of large scale cooperation as the norm of daily labor.
For introverts, a society that recognizes the essentially social character of labor is far better because it makes possible the overall reduction of labor by making production more focused on need. In capitalism it does not matter how materially productive we are, because the basis of profit is how much abstract labor you can accumulate (as money) regardless of how productive that labor was.
The discussion about how driving and riding mass transit are highly social modes of transportation has me thinking about what an entirely non-social mode of transportation would look like. Perhaps cycling home on a secluded dirt trail? (Or perhaps the non-commute of work from home also counts)
Teleporting lol
Those modes of travel are social, not when viewed abstractly, but when they exist in a social context.
The question is why do the masses all commute along the same paths? The answer is found in the physical distribution of home and work, and the economy of building shared resources at those destination e.g. apartment buildings and office buildings. So when I’m traveling to work, my travel isn’t independent, it presupposes a society where a large number of people work together in one building or downtown.
So driving a bus on the moon would be non-social, but driving a bus through NYC is social. But I guess the moon is getting crowded these days too with all the rovers.
Public transit is not demanding of social interaction. I’m an introvert who moved to the city and ditched my car. Just being around people is a different thing from enjoying going out of my way to have conversations with them.
Social interaction is not limited to verbal communication. Letting someone merge on the highway is social interaction. Lining up to board the train is social interaction. Social interaction happens even without opening your mouth.