Recently I posted a pretty harmless meme in my DSA chapter’s Discord (see image). It was in response to South Korea’s recent spate of Fascism.
In response I had comrades jump down my throat, attacking me for critical support of AES states like DPRK and China. According to these comrades “there is no real Socialist nation.”
As tempting as it is to quit DSA I think I should stay and try to educate.
Comrades also jumped on me for a comment I made months ago in response to some right wing BS where I said “maybe Democracy isn’t always a great idea”. The point I was trying to make was that Trans rights and other basic freedoms should never be put up to a popularity contest… I’m ok with a state that defends these rights and doesn’t allow a reactionary majority to vote them away!
During this thread, people brought up multiple times that DPRK isn’t Democratic because the Kim’s have always been the figurehead, China isn’t Democratic because “reasons” (racism), China lies about their suicide rates to WHO, etc.
Frustrating. I’ll post more details in the comments.
My question: What constitutes a “real” Democracy? Is it leadership changing hands every few years? We don’t have that in the U.S. Is it secret ballots? All the nationa above have that. Is it that the people’s votes and voices actually change the government actions? We saw this in China unfortunately when people demanded ending the COVID lock downs early. It was the wrong thing to do but done for the right reason.
And is there any hope for these people in my chapter? One of them was basically racist against Chinese people and they seem very set in this “not real Socialism” mindset.
What? I am curious as to how you mean or have experienced maoists being shitty but I havent had the chance to meet anyone who identifies as such.
The local MCU chapter has the pro-Mao, anti-Deng line. I understand where they’re coming from but also am trying to understand the history and conditions that led to things like the Deng reforms. I think the situation is more nuanced than “Deng betrayed China”.
Then again I don’t think it matters since this is one of the orgs with a year-long initiation process. How to grow your org: Make it harder for people to join :p
they are ultra leftists who exist in the US context as a group of Sinophobes who ironically worship a Chinese man without being able to apply that own man’s tools of analysis to their own strategies, instead opting to copy and paste what was relevant to China 75 years ago as if that is what needs to happen in Chicago, Boston, or Dallas in 2024.
In my personal organizing experience, they are wreckers who use a lot of words to take up a lot of space and aggressively push their positions without any evidence aside from hearkening back to a country on the other side of the planet’s revolution almost a century ago as the gold standard. Similar to trots and anarchists, always against the sincere communists and ending up on the side of imperialists against them.
The basis of their analysis is incorrect, and so they see the world and what needs to be done incorrectly as well.