Mitch McConell says the quiet part out loud.

Exact full quote from CNN:

“People think, increasingly it appears, that we shouldn’t be doing this. Well, let me start by saying we haven’t lost a single American in this war,” McConnell said. “Most of the money that we spend related to Ukraine is actually spent in the US, replenishing weapons, more modern weapons. So it’s actually employing people here and improving our own military for what may lie ahead.”

cross-posted from: https://lemm.ee/post/4085063

  • boredtortoise@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    I find in all Russia’s statements kind of ridiculous that it would have a say in how other sovereign countries handle their safety. Ukraine and Georgia have their own decisions to make

    • aaaaaaadjsf [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      12
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      Ukraine and Georgia have their own decisions to make

      Then “the west” should let them make their own decisions instead of instigating coups everytime they decide against western interests.

      • boredtortoise@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        Of course, in the most simplified form. But I take it you maybe don’t mean Monaco or Uruguay or Botswana etc.

        • aaaaaaadjsf [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          11
          ·
          1 year ago

          Yes I mean “the west” in the geopolitical term, not the geographical term. I think it’s the one that gets the point across the clearest. I could also use the term imperial core or imperial triad, but I’m not sure if many would understand it.

          • boredtortoise@lemm.ee
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            arrow-down
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            Yeah I get it. It somewhat scratches off Botswana.

            Imperial core or triad is an interesting and new take yes… Could be USA+Russia+China. Isn’t that more than “the west”. Some can’t decide if Russia is west or not.

            I see some applying that term to US and changing the rest between anyone maintaining neutral relations with them. Yeah probably not an accurate idea.

            • aaaaaaadjsf [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              10
              ·
              1 year ago

              The imperial triad is actually an old term, coined by Samir Amin I think, it refers to the co operation between the USA, Europe and Japan. Hence the usage of triad. And imperial because they are the old school imperial and colonial powers.

              This is why I prefer using “the west”, because people generally know what I’m talking about. As illustrated by your comment assuming the imperial triad could refer to USA + China + Russia, instead of the actual definition.

    • Frank [he/him, he/him]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      12
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      You know sovereignty isn’t real, right? Like it’s just not? Countries invade whoever they want whenever they think they can get away with it? Most of Europe just went in to Iraq illegally and murdered a million people? Ukraine sent a lot of troops on that adventure. The US just kills people and topples governments all over? France controls colonial possessions in Africa? Canada de-facto runs a bunch of African territory through it’s ruthless resource extraction firms? South Korea and Okinawa are under US military occupation? North Korea only remains Sovereign because they can make Seoul glow in the dark if the US tries something? The west uses ruthless monetary manipulation, dumping of consumer goods and food, outright piracy and theft, to control other countries?

      This isn’t model UN.

    • silent_water [she/her]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      6
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      you do know there’s been an ongoing civil war in Ukraine since 2013 and that fascists have been genociding Russian speakers in the independent republics that have been trying to split off from Ukraine in that time, right? and you know that Ukraine violated multiple peace treaties in the process of doing so?

      • boredtortoise@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        3
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        And we know that the separatist fascists are Russian plants. The future will tell us how much there’s a real independence movement instead in the areas.

        Nevertheless, conquering and genociding whole Ukraine is not approvable

            • Frank [he/him, he/him]@hexbear.net
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              3
              ·
              1 year ago

              The very first thing the Rada did when they were installed after the coup was ban the use of the Russian language in all official capacities. The country had been de-facto multilingual up until that point, though legally you were supposed to use Ukrainian. Give the ethnic and regional nature of the coup, ie Galacians vs everyone out East, it sent a pretty strong message which was received and understood in Donbas.

              • MoreAmphibians [none/use name]@hexbear.net
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                3
                ·
                1 year ago

                I didn’t realize that was the very first act of the Rada. I was thinking it was appointing Natalie Jaresko as finance minster. She was an American who became a Ukrainian citizen the same day she was appointed as finance minister. That happened a lot later than I thought though.

        • silent_water [she/her]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          8
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          the idea that no one can think for themselves and must all be plants, shills, or dupes because they don’t support your worldview is just plain racist. those damn asiastics, how could they possibly want to live their own lives and be free from shelling by a coup government that’s trying to annihilate them – it must be plants.

                  • boredtortoise@lemm.ee
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    0
                    arrow-down
                    1
                    ·
                    edit-2
                    1 year ago

                    We shouldn’t entertain myopic worldviews like everyone is a plant even though we know of some

                    We can assume good out of most and be critical of bullshit. Also helpful advice for avoiding misunderstandings :)

        • Maoo [none/use name]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          10
          arrow-down
          4
          ·
          1 year ago

          Those lifelong Ukrainian trade unionists locked in their union hall and set on fire? Yeah, just fascust Russian plants.

          How did I arrive at such a smart and correct thought? I get that question a lot. Listen, tankie

    • barrbaric [he/him]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      1 year ago

      It’s not pretty but this is how the world works. If a man is holding a gun to your head, and says he’ll kill you if you don’t give him your wallet, do you hold onto the wallet out of principle because robbery is immoral?

      • Gsus4@feddit.nl
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        lol, thug ethics. AKA offensive realist geopolitics. The great do what they want and the small accept their fate.

        • Frank [he/him, he/him]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          8
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Jesus christ bro Realpolitik is all there is and all there has ever been. When you live on a planet where a bunch of gerotocratic psychopaths could push the big red button at any time you don’t play games. You know America is the baddies, right?

        • Maoo [none/use name]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          10
          arrow-down
          5
          ·
          1 year ago

          There is no ethics between capitalist states, there are only stratagems for how to exploit everyone else and not get exploited yourself.

          Rhetoric about liberal world orders and rules and ethics are just propaganda to keep their own people complacent, like providing indulgences to themselves. They are wildly inconsistent and the self-named “good guys” carry out the absolute worst violence.

      • timespace@lemmy.ninja
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        Ohhhh, I get hexbear now.

        Wow, what an amazingly terrible worldview.

        “I told you I was going to rob you if you tried to defend yourself, it’s your fault.”

        • Gsus4@feddit.nl
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          That’s the genesis of the word “tankie”, much misused today: they say they are communist, but then advocate for the law of the strongest and can’t conceive of an alliance that isn’t more than vassalage and sending in the “tanks” against their allies to ensure they don’t fall out of line. That’s why everyone ran away from the Warsaw Pact when it ended whereas NATO endured.

      • sol@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        The man with the gun to his head doesn’t have much of a choice if he wants to live. You, though, have a choice between criticising and defending the man with the gun, and you’re choosing to defend him.

        • Frank [he/him, he/him]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          10
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          Bruv you’re not this dense. NATO, an alliance constructed for the express purpose of destroying Russia, which did not disband when the USSR was destroyed, which continued to advance towards and encircle Russia for decades after the fall of the USSR, which refused the RF’s attempts to join the alliance, which has engaged in numerous illegal wars of aggression, is the man holding the gun and I swear to god just because you were born there that does not make them the good guys.

      • boredtortoise@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        Alone, you do what you do to stay alive.

        That’s why the world and people need its alliances, unities and consequences for harmful actions. The world doesn’t work by giving up to the worst offender.

        Russia is holding a gun to Ukraine’s head and saying it’ll both kill and take everything.

        • Frank [he/him, he/him]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          9
          ·
          1 year ago

          The world doesn’t work by giving up to the worst offender.

          Yeah it does. Everyone does what America says or America either coups their leader or launches an illegal war of aggression and starts slaughtering their people. I